Author Topic: Out sourced when?  (Read 3533 times)

Offline AmericaMade

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Out sourced when?
« on: February 23, 2018, 08:42:18 AM »
How much of Chevys car/trucks were unAmerican by 83’.
Meaning how much of the parts and assembly were still done here?
Ive seen Argentina was used for parts but to what extent was Chevy not produced here?
A guy was telling by 83’ Chevy was completely unAmerican by then the wiki says otherwise.
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Offline Stewart G Griffin

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Re: Out sourced when?
« Reply #1 on: February 24, 2018, 05:36:42 PM »
How do you define, "un-american?"

i consider a Honda Accord, even if assembled in Ohio, a Japanese car.

El Caminos were made in Mexico, but i consider it an American (USA) truck.

My truck was assembled at the Oshawa plant, but that doesn't make it "Canadian?"

It's all about brands to me.  Where is the brand from?

Offline Stewart G Griffin

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Re: Out sourced when?
« Reply #2 on: February 24, 2018, 05:37:27 PM »
P.S.
Do you consider any truck with a Duramax engine to be "un-american?"

Offline 1967KaiserM715

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Re: Out sourced when?
« Reply #3 on: February 26, 2018, 05:39:20 AM »
You need to look at the vin...think the 3rd or 4th number/letter tells the assembly plant. My dad's 2006 was assembled in Flint Michigan, and the engine(duramax) was also assembled there(possibly, they still did engine assembly there, but supply and demand could dictate otherwise) both of my bosses 2007 classic 3500 dumps were assembled in Texas.


Outsourcing is needed to keep cost down. Without outsourcing a new domestic car would likely be as expensive if not more then cars like Porsche, Mercedes and might even go as expensive as a Lamborghini.  There is a reason those cars are expensive, and it's not because of parts, it's because of the labor.

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Offline ehjorten

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Re: Out sourced when?
« Reply #4 on: February 26, 2018, 09:07:20 AM »
The point Stewart was making is that the Duramax is an Isuzu engine.  My 1977 K20 had some Canadian interior parts on it!  Does that make it un-American?

To me, it means more where the company is from.  GM is an American company.  They may make parts and cars outside of the USA, but in the end, all of the profit comes back to GM the US.  Toyota may make cars in the USA, but in the end the company is Japanese and the profits go back to Japan.

In reality, it is much more complicated than that in a Global Economy.  Labor rates in Mexico are roughly 7 times less than in the USA!  China used to be the place where everyone wanted to go, but that economy is changing and it isn't as cheap to go there anymore.  I've argued at work to keep tools in the USA instead of China and we have been able to do that in some cases because it actually turned out to be better financially to do so.  It depends on the situation.  It is nice to say let's do it all in American, but if that were the case; like Kaiser said, it would be WAY to expensive!  I try to buy American first, but it isn't practical in every situation.
-Erik-
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Offline 1967KaiserM715

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Re: Out sourced when?
« Reply #5 on: February 27, 2018, 06:29:21 AM »


The point Stewart was making is that the Duramax is an Isuzu engine.

It was a joint venture design, and is manufactured in ohio (had to look that one up) gm took control after a year or so in 2002, and is currently looking to do(or is now?) in state casting of the blocks (currently or was Germany casting) so technically it is a mostly "American" engine.

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Offline ehjorten

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Re: Out sourced when?
« Reply #6 on: February 27, 2018, 09:00:22 AM »
Kaiser...I would say that is optimistic at best.  The MD engine was still an Isuzu, just rebadged for GM.  While they may be casting blocks in Ohio now, I bet most of the design is still Isuzu.  GM may be spec'ing more of the engine now, but joint venture design usually means we are going to take what you designed...make some tweaks and put our badge on it.  The Powertrain division of Isuzu Motors is in Plymouth, Michigan, but Isuzu is still a Japanese company.  I highly doubt Isuzu just gave up the rights to their engine design to GM.
-Erik-
1991 V3500 - Gen V TBI 454, 4L80E, NP205, 14 bolt FF, D60, 8" Lift on 35s
1977 K20 Silverado - 350, THM350, NP203, 14 bolt FF, D44, Stock Lift on 31s
1969 Chevelle Malibu Sport Coupe - EFI350, THM350
1968 Chevrolet Step-side Pickup - 300HP L6

Offline AmericaMade

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Re: Out sourced when?
« Reply #7 on: March 05, 2018, 04:19:40 PM »
I ask because I was in typical online argument. With someones and their shoe company and I said “would be nice if the company that is selling a SoCal image actually produced their product in America”
Their response was “tylical&&&& you claim to be working on an 83’ chevy which was assembled in Argentina, which isnt America”
Yeah well no shiz.
So I looked around and by 83’ Chevy was in a few places. I was wondering when the truck stopped being assembled soley in America and how much of the trucks were actually assembled oitside the US or how much of the truck was assembled outsid the US”
Didnt really matter as the guys arguemt was lame af.
1983 C10 Scottsdale 383 Stroker TH/350 Holley 850 Double pumper carb

Offline Jason S

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Re: Out sourced when?
« Reply #8 on: March 05, 2018, 10:03:20 PM »
"83’ chevy which was assembled in Argentina, which isnt America"... I was wondering when the truck stopped being assembled soley in America and how much of the trucks were actually assembled oitside the US or how much of the truck was assembled outside the US

I don't have any ideas on numbers, but I'd be willing to bet that few Argentine produced Chevrolet trucks made it to North America.

The Big Three sold cars & trucks worldwide since well before World War II.  Many countries had in-country assembly and domestically produced engines (often of U.S. design) for sale in that country. A couple of examples were Ford in South America and Australia, Chevrolet in South America and Dodge/DeSoto/Fargo trucks in South America and Australia. Another example is General Motors, South Africa (GMSA) - founded in 1913 and by 1926 manufactured and distributed all of GM's brands 1.

The Chevrolet trucks outside the U.S. (especially in South America) often lagged behind the U.S. models by a few years or even a body style. In many cases there were stampings (beds and some cab offerings) that were indigenous to the country. Years earlier than the U.S., Chevrolet and Ford both had a style of truck in South America that was much like the modern Chevrolet Avalanche. Here on Flickr is a Brazil brochure showing some of the Brazilian Chevrolet trucks.

GM do Brasil (GM in Brazil) began in 1925 2. Chevrolet had truck assembly in Brazil as far back as the 1950's (possibly earlier). The Brazilian designs eventually diverged from the U.S. trucks. By the 1980's the truck had it's own look but with some design elements from the U.S. 1970's trucks. http://forum.73-87chevytrucks.com/smforum/index.php?topic=11634.msg86208#msg86208 Also see above linked brochure.

Argentina Chevrolet trucks were more similar to U.S. trucks, but still had several distinguishing features. 
Some discussion here with links to Flickr photos: http://forum.73-87chevytrucks.com/smforum/index.php?topic=34895.msg296265#msg296265 

Here is a 1980 Chevrolet C-10 from Argentina:  https://www.flickr.com/photos/118029649@N03/32061316064/in/photostream/ 

Just for giggles, here is a 1973 Argentine Chevrolet Pickup: https://www.flickr.com/photos/118029649@N03/34067905492/ 67-72 bodystyle with 61-66 taillights and distinct tailgate.

One last photo shows ...Chevrolet Coca-Cola delivery trucks in Brazil...  Nothin' more American than Chevrolet and Coca-Cola... 
1973 GMC K2500, Super Custom, Camper Special, 350, TH350, NP203, 4.10's
1974 Chevrolet K10, Custom Deluxe, 350, SM465, NP203, 3.73's

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Offline AmericaMade

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Re: Out sourced when?
« Reply #9 on: March 06, 2018, 09:39:36 AM »
Thanks for post. Above.
The guys were arguing in a “gotcha” douche way.
“How can you claim Vans (shoes) should be made in America when your truck wasn't”.
It was lame and in bad faith.
Vans sells a SoCal vibe and this guy and Steve Cabellero were saying it is a one world vibe.
Which is bs.. When I think of Vans, Nigeria doesnt come to mind.
They were saying nobody would pay for American made stuff.. again more BS.
Anyway it was lame. Chevy is an American truck.
1983 C10 Scottsdale 383 Stroker TH/350 Holley 850 Double pumper carb

Offline Engineer

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Re: Out sourced when?
« Reply #10 on: March 15, 2018, 06:34:30 PM »
Just a guess, but I would say when the last 1987 M/Y Chevy/GMC square rolled off the StLouis assembly line 90% was still US production. The remaining 10% would be foreign but a majority of that being Canadian origin.

After the StLouis plant closed, production was moved to a new (at the time) plant in Ft.Wayne, IN. My uncle worked at the StLouis assembly plant and Ft.Wayne was one option he was given to finish out his 30. The Wentzville, MO plant was another. Since he was close he went ahead and took an early out with partial benefits.


JasonS-

During WWII the US 8th Air Force bombed both Ford and GM plants. GM sued the US government and won $32 million for damage to the Opel AG plant in Brandenburg, DE. I have a 100+ books on the air war but cannot remember which one has info about the Ford and GM plants outside of Paris.

Since you also brought up Coca-Cola...... during WWII Coca-Cola needed to get their products in the hands of GIs to maintain morale while away from home. It was not possible to produce Coca-Cola in the US and ship it overseas since US shipping was at capacity hauling essentials like bullets, bombs and butter. There just wasn’t room. So Coca-Cola’s solution was to build plants in Europe and the Pacific. Coca-Cola had 2 employees killed in their plant in Belgium when the Germans counter attacked in what is now known as the Battle of the Bulge.
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