Lunati cam and Pro Comp head discussion

[nlauffer]

Today was AWESOME!!!  I got my short block (minus cam) and cylinder heads from the machinist. It has been since around June 1 or so. I also took the wife and kids to the drags. A 9 year old girl, 8 & 4 year old boys are now excited about racing and dads engine.
We also picked up a cage for the two new rabbits for my kids. They have been begging.
And my wife got a new pair of shoes. I guess we all had a great day.

Side note:  my heads are cast iron center or perimeter bolt valve cover option, angled plugs, 2.02/1.60 valves, 3/8 screw in ARP rocker studs, comp cams pushrod guide plates. This is all I know for sure. The heads have EQ between the springs and say RH350Z on the ends. I can't find any info on these. EQ doesn't list an RH350Z and I was told they were RHS but EQ used to make them for RHS or something like that. My machinist said that and also they were 64cc chambers but I haven't fluid checked them yet.
Does anyone know about these heads?
Can I check intake runner volume by pouring them full like checking combustion chamber?  If so how?

I need to figure out how to get smaller pics on my IPhone because I can't get any of them to load unless I email them first to myself and change the size then.

[454Man]

Get the Tapatalk app the up loads are huge.

What's under the hood??? If you have to ask maybe we shouldn't race...

[nlauffer]

This works great. Thanks


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[454Man]

Yup no prob :-)

What's under the hood??? If you have to ask maybe we shouldn't race...

[nlauffer]

My heads are cast iron center or perimeter bolt valve cover option, angled plugs, 2.02/1.60 valves, 3/8 screw in ARP rocker studs, comp cams pushrod guide plates. This is all I know for sure. The heads have EQ between the springs and say RH350Z on the ends. I can't find any info on these. EQ doesn't list an RH350Z and I was told they were RHS but EQ used to make them for RHS or something like that. My machinist said that and also they were 64cc chambers but I haven't fluid checked them yet.
Does anyone know about these heads?
Can I check intake runner volume by pouring them full like checking combustion chamber?  If so how?

[nlauffer]

I've also been keeping an eye on Lunati's Closeout list.  Here are a couple

20080130  $70.40, normally $300
Hydraulic Roller Cam. Fair idle, great low to mid range power for daily usage. Works well with tune port injection.
•Advertised Duration (Intake/Exhaust): 276/286
•Duration @.050" (Intake/Exhaust): 218/228
•Gross Valve Lift (Intake/Exhaust): .503"/.503"
•Lobe Seperation: 112
•Intake Center Line: 108
•RPM Range: 1800-5800
•Cam only included.

And this one, I like it.  What do you think?

10120208 - $31.24  normally $143
Hydraulic Flat Tappet. Excellent street cam with 3.40+ gearing and stock stall converter. Good idle.
Advertised Duration (Int/Exh): 268/268
Duration @ .050 (Int/Exh): 218/218
Gross Valve Lift (Int/Exh): .457/.457
LSA/ICL: 110/106
Valve Lash (Int/Exh): Hyd/Hyd
RPM Range: 1500-5500 Includes: Cam Only

[nlauffer]

I'm not interested in the first one, I thought some of you one here would like it for the price.

[nlauffer]

Rich, the last one about the close out cam was directed at you. Compared to the other cams you ran up what does this one do. For $30 I might just get it because of price and it is in my power range choice.


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[rich weyand]

Bear in mind that the cam IS the engine.  The rest of the parts exist to service the cam's needs.  The cam has more influence on how the engine operates than anything else -- cam choice is EVERYTHING.  Given that, I wouldn't let price steer me to a specific cam over another that was a better choice.

Here's a nice article about cam selection: http://www.crankshaftcoalition.com/wiki/How_to_choose_a_camshaft

I can't find the full cam card on the 10120208 cam on the net, so I don't have the full timing map.  It seems like a lot of duration to me for what you want.  I would think something like 252/260 or 254/262 would be better.  The old grind 252/260 cams with a 110 LSA were very popular for street use, and a modern grind cam flows a lot better than an older grind 252/260 because the valves open and close so much faster.  (Subtract .050 duration from advertised duration; 75* is old grind, 45*-50* is modern grind.) 

The 12-235-2 Comp cam that Sean Murphy recommended to me for my 350 in a K10 is a modern grind 254/262 with a 111 LSA; the cam I ultimately chose is only a 240/248 with a 108 LSA, but again with the modern grind.  I also have only .390/.390 lift to hold down valvetrain wear, where the 12-235-2 has .447/.462 lift.  Pretty similar all in all to the Lunati except for the duration, where mine is much more focused on bottom end torque than either of the other two.

That Lunati cam looks a lot like the Comp XE268H, number 12-242-2.  For grins I ran that XE268H cam on the same parameters I ran the other two: http://users.rcn.com/weyand/smalls/12-242-2nlauffer.jpg.  Note that torque PEAK is the same, but 500 rpm higher than the 12-235-2.  Looking at the torque converter recommendations will tell you a lot.  Print them both out and then lay the pages one over the other and hold up to the light.  Look at the torque curves from 1500-3500 rpm.

Overall, I think that the Lunati cam is too much duration (which means higher overlap, lower torque at a given rpm, less gas mileage, less static compression, and more horsepower higher up in the rpm range) for what you want.  The 12-235-2 is under $110 at Carid and Northern Auto.

I would be interested in other people's opinions on this on the forum here.  I googled that Lunati cam number and can't find any discussion of it anywhere on the net.  I would not buy any cam without being able to find some discussion of it somewhere and see who's happy or sad with it and what kind of vehicle they put it in.

[nlauffer]

I'm back to my post. I'll try to stay here. The more I read and lookup cams I am starting to pick up some more. Makes more sense. I have been having trouble with Comps website. It keeps giving me an error and I can't open the Camquest. I'll keep trying.

I did like some of the comp xtreme energy cams though. I like there options more than lunati I think. More of them at least.  The xe262 which I think is the 12-235-2. Is the one I might end up with but I have said that before and still haven't ordered one yet.

I am waiting on a call back from EQ. I found out my heads are an obsolete number from 2005. Eric is hopefully gonna call with specs. I'm also debating taking them to a head magician in Stafford to flow and cc them. They are used so who knows what they are now.

[454Man]

Rich I think with those eq heads and a small cam he would not use the full potential of HP and tq those heads and the right split pattern cam would produce... Just my 2 cents

What's under the hood??? If you have to ask maybe we shouldn't race...

[nlauffer]

Another thing I was thinking about is what happens when you go to 1.6 rocker arms?  It increases lift, but does it leave duration alone?

[454Man]

No they will increase duration as well

What's under the hood??? If you have to ask maybe we shouldn't race...

[rich weyand]

Rich I think with those eq heads and a small cam he would not use the full potential of HP and tq those heads and the right split pattern cam would produce... Just my 2 cents

Depends on what he wants.  I ran the dyno curves using a 9.5:1 compression, which is about what he ought to get with 64cc heads.

Here's both curves.  What looks better to you for use in a truck for street use?

http://users.rcn.com/weyand/smalls/12-242-2nlauffer.jpg
http://users.rcn.com/weyand/smalls/12-235-2nlauffer.jpg

[454Man]

Does the dyno have a seeing specifically for those head. I've ran that dyno b4... port velocity plays a factor along with the valve size as well.

What's under the hood??? If you have to ask maybe we shouldn't race...