Author Topic: Squeaky Drum Brakes & A Terrible Mechanic.  (Read 21922 times)

Offline JohnnyPopper

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Re: Squeaky Drum Brakes & A Terrible Mechanic.
« Reply #270 on: April 14, 2021, 04:49:26 PM »
Mike, I think he told VZ that he used the old ones for now.

Good points on new products.
1957 Apache 3100 235 Inline 6, 3 on the tree
1973 C-20, 3+3 454 4BBL TH400  Water Injection
1978 K-10, 350 4BBL TH350 NP203 M.M. Part time Kit/Hubs
1980 C-10 under construction

Offline VileZambonie

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Re: Squeaky Drum Brakes & A Terrible Mechanic.
« Reply #271 on: April 15, 2021, 06:30:53 AM »
That's reasonable.  But how do you prevent a recurrence?  Replacing the drums will increase drum mass which will alter the harmonics.  Even if drums are perfectly round and concentric when first installed, what prevents them from distorting with repeated heat cycles?  This isn't to argue with your statement but how do you ensure long-term reliability?

Drum brakes are like a high maintenance girlfriend always needing attention.  ;D Clean and adjust for optimum performance. Shoes vibrating resonates through the drum, so make sure they do not vibrate and they will not create the harmonic. I have never had drum brake noise not be solved with good cleaning and proper lubrication, good hardware, proper adjustment, and a properly finished surface. Let's ASSume the measurements he got on the drums were correct, they should have been resurfaced or replaced at that point. Since he can't find someone competent in his area to properly refinish drums (this is quite disturbing), the next best option is replacement.
,                           ___ 
                         /  _ _ _\_
              ⌠ŻŻŻŻŻ'   [☼===☼]
              `()_);-;()_)--o--)_)

74 GMC, 75 K5, 84 GMC, 85 K20, 86 k20, 79 K10

Offline Spool

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Re: Squeaky Drum Brakes & A Terrible Mechanic.
« Reply #272 on: April 18, 2021, 10:58:13 AM »
Okay. Thank you all for for the great info. Allow me to address many of your points into one cohesive post to see if we can collectively come to a new point.

Johnny, you had mentioned the drums may be out of round causing the shoes to squeak against the backing plate. This makes sense to me. When I was adjusting the shoes/turning the drum to the point where I was unable to turn it anymore, to then back off 25 clicks, I could feel that at one point of my full drum rotation that there was contact with the shoe- leading me to believe that the drum was in fact not round. So, perhaps this is it.

Someone else mentioned maybe the drums still had glaze. I kept the old drums for now as to not have to bother with trying to press out the old hub and press the new hub into new drums. That, and the drums were still within legal wear according to the measure I received at PepBoys. However, I did score the inside the of the drums with a coarse emery cloth before installing placing them again.

Now, Mike mentioned that new products aren't made like they used to be. With that I didn't score the brake shoes themselves, I merely set the hardware as best I could to represent the reference photos I had and then confirmed here on the forum. Hit it with some brake cleaner (no the backing plate landings which had white lithium grease on them) and then reinstalled the drums. As Vile, mentioned, the drums will need a lot of attention to get it perfect.

Lastly, BD mentioned how my brakes aren't squeaking due to them being out of round, but they are squeaking due to resonance. This makes perfect sense to me. At the moment, when my brakes do squeak, they are singing as loud as an opera! After driving for about 5 days now, I can draw one conclusion- they appear to squeak after I drive/brake for about 15 minutes. Mind you, that 15 minutes, is usually stop and go traffic, so I believe the rear brakes begin to squeak after they heat a bit due to friction.

In conclusion, it sounds like I made a dire mistake in 'testing' my brakes my hammering on them to see if they worked.
Further more, it sounds like I should obtain my spacer behind the inner lock nut first and fore most.
1. Take the drums off.
2. Confirm the shoes are still properly in place.
3. Sand the surface of the shoe landings with emery cloth and the same with the drums.
4. Hit with brake clean.
5. Place the drums, adjust till I can no longer rotate the tire, and back off 25 notches again.
6. Drive with the brakes, yet do not hammer on them.
7. Give it a bit of time for the shoes to adjust to the drums.

After this, if the problem persist, I'm to find a proper machinist to either
a) machine the drums to ensure roundness or b) replace the drums entirely.

Would you guys agree with this?

« Last Edit: April 18, 2021, 11:17:11 AM by Spool »

Offline JohnnyPopper

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Re: Squeaky Drum Brakes & A Terrible Mechanic.
« Reply #273 on: April 24, 2021, 11:18:46 AM »
 


REAR DRIVE AXLE WHEEL BEARING ADJUSTMENT SPECIFICATIONS

Type of Bearing:  tapered roller

Ring Gear Size:  10-1/2”

* Bearing Inner Adjusting Nut Torque with Wheel Rotating and Zero Brake Drag:  50 Ft-Lbs, then back off nut and retighten to 35 Ft-Lbs, then back off nut 1/4 turn.  Install the retainer ring and outer locknut.

Outer Locknut Torque:  65 Ft-Lbs

Resulting Bearing Adjustment End-Play:  0.001 to 0.010"


MISCELLANEOUS TORQUE SPECIFICATIONS

Axle Flange Bolt Torque:  90 Ft-Lbs

Wheel Lug Nut Bolt Torque:  90-120 Ft-Lbs (9/16" studs)


APPROXIMATE FLUID CAPACITY

10-1/2" Ring Gear:  5.4 pints

[/quote]

bd would this bearing adjustment apply to front bearings on a K10?
1957 Apache 3100 235 Inline 6, 3 on the tree
1973 C-20, 3+3 454 4BBL TH400  Water Injection
1978 K-10, 350 4BBL TH350 NP203 M.M. Part time Kit/Hubs
1980 C-10 under construction

Offline Spool

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Re: Squeaky Drum Brakes & A Terrible Mechanic.
« Reply #274 on: May 01, 2021, 11:53:46 AM »
Hey guys.
Hope all has been well with you. Been a little distracted from the truck these past two weeks.
My wife flew into LA after four months apart - (she's Austrian and pandemic severely bottlenecked out residency card processes to live abroad- so we travel to and fro at the moment.)

Anyway- Small update.
Last week, I placed the the spacer behind the inner lock nut that I didn't have on the passenger side.
Also, took off the cover for the pumpkin, drained the gear oil, replaced the gasket and filled her back up. Fun job and first gasket I ever replaced! Good stuff.

The squeaky brakes have been less squeaky lately, so I've been riding them out to see how they behave.
I believe, I can say with confidence, that they only squeak when the temp in LA rises above 80F- am I crazy?
They've been behaving pretty well, so I figured if they start misbehaving, then I'll take it apart and proceed with sanding down the shoe and drum a bit more.

Thoughts?


Okay. Thank you all for for the great info. Allow me to address many of your points into one cohesive post to see if we can collectively come to a new point.

Johnny, you had mentioned the drums may be out of round causing the shoes to squeak against the backing plate. This makes sense to me. When I was adjusting the shoes/turning the drum to the point where I was unable to turn it anymore, to then back off 25 clicks, I could feel that at one point of my full drum rotation that there was contact with the shoe- leading me to believe that the drum was in fact not round. So, perhaps this is it.

Someone else mentioned maybe the drums still had glaze. I kept the old drums for now as to not have to bother with trying to press out the old hub and press the new hub into new drums. That, and the drums were still within legal wear according to the measure I received at PepBoys. However, I did score the inside the of the drums with a coarse emery cloth before installing placing them again.

Now, Mike mentioned that new products aren't made like they used to be. With that I didn't score the brake shoes themselves, I merely set the hardware as best I could to represent the reference photos I had and then confirmed here on the forum. Hit it with some brake cleaner (no the backing plate landings which had white lithium grease on them) and then reinstalled the drums. As Vile, mentioned, the drums will need a lot of attention to get it perfect.

Lastly, BD mentioned how my brakes aren't squeaking due to them being out of round, but they are squeaking due to resonance. This makes perfect sense to me. At the moment, when my brakes do squeak, they are singing as loud as an opera! After driving for about 5 days now, I can draw one conclusion- they appear to squeak after I drive/brake for about 15 minutes. Mind you, that 15 minutes, is usually stop and go traffic, so I believe the rear brakes begin to squeak after they heat a bit due to friction.

In conclusion, it sounds like I made a dire mistake in 'testing' my brakes my hammering on them to see if they worked.
Further more, it sounds like I should obtain my spacer behind the inner lock nut first and fore most.
1. Take the drums off.
2. Confirm the shoes are still properly in place.
3. Sand the surface of the shoe landings with emery cloth and the same with the drums.
4. Hit with brake clean.
5. Place the drums, adjust till I can no longer rotate the tire, and back off 25 notches again.
6. Drive with the brakes, yet do not hammer on them.
7. Give it a bit of time for the shoes to adjust to the drums.

After this, if the problem persist, I'm to find a proper machinist to either
a) machine the drums to ensure roundness or b) replace the drums entirely.

Would you guys agree with this?