73-87chevytrucks.com
73-87 Chevy _ GMC Trucks => Engine/Drivetrain => Topic started by: vjfelix55 on May 03, 2017, 04:41:47 PM
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Alright everybody after enough being disappointed by how my 81 K20 was running I decided it was time for a rebuild on my 350. This is gonna give me a chance to fix clean and paint everything that needs those things. I'm not looking to build a high end 350 that puts out a ton of hp, just a reliable 350 that I can use as a daily. This is my first time rebuilding a motor but I'm pretty confident in my skills.
I've already stripped everything off the block, disconnected the tranny and everything holding the dang thing to the truck except motor mounts. The block will be coming out sometime within the next couple days and in the meantime I figured why not ask the experts and people who've done this before for some advice!
I'm gonna be using this thread to show my progress with the rebuild and ask any questions I may have. Here's what pictures I've got so far:
I placed most bolts back in the holes they came out of for now so I don't lose them but I'll eventually get some bags and label them accordingly.
The transmission is disconnected and will also be dropped and cleaned thoroughly (especially around the t-case)
So here's the question I've got so far: What parts/brands should I get to build an extremely reliable 350. Any parts you guys can think of. Any help is greatly appreciated and I will continue to update this thread with my progress.
Thanks everyone (https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20170503/89d49e3db29897a9f13ca820e651160b.jpg)(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20170503/2cb6d2f2828badb9b658a81c16f3b76f.jpg)(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20170503/dac64489ed9e26889da246d830010736.jpg)(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20170503/c2e4d1a8d4b677497b038a4aca9a12b5.jpg)
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Have fun with it.
Start putting a spreadsheet together using summits website. It will make for a good tracking sheet and record for your build. Summit stands behind their products and are good to deal with. Trust I've dealt with other lousy distributors and summit will price match.
I would hold off on brand loyalty and speak in specifics about specific parts you are questioning. For example, Edelbrock is a good brand however they do not make all of their own parts so an Edelbrock camshaft might be good but their shock absorbers not so much. Mic everything up and record your measurements so you order the right parts. Maybe post your build sheet and then ask for opinions.
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Have fun with it.
Start putting a spreadsheet together using summits website. It will make for a good tracking sheet and record for your build. Summit stands behind their products and are good to deal with. Trust I've dealt with other lousy distributors and summit will price match.
I would hold off on brand loyalty and speak in specifics about specific parts you are questioning. For example, Edelbrock is a good brand however they do not make all of their own parts so an Edelbrock camshaft might be good but their shock absorbers not so much. Mic everything up and record your measurements so you order the right parts. Maybe post your build sheet and then ask for opinions.
Thanks a lot really looking forward to this, really gonna start my career in the mechanics field. I'll see what happens when the motor comes out thanks again 😁
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Ok guys I got my hoist ready to pull the engine probably tomorrow or Wednesday then its disassembly time and machining but I've come to my first big question!
Should I buy a rebuild kit (gaskets, bearings, rings etc) or get specific brand gaskets, bearings, piston rings (if so which ones?) And buy them all separately, or what would you guys recommend? Btw I'm sticking with the stock bore. Thanks again!
Also this is the brand new hoist from a friend he only used once to put a 302 in his 67 mustang, I was concerned it wouldn't lift high enough and a friend told me "why dont you deflate your front tires?" It was pure genius (https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20170509/9551dda938ee823b18908144bc185aa5.jpg)
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(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20170503/c2e4d1a8d4b677497b038a4aca9a12b5.jpg)
If you haven't done so already, remove the oil pressure sender and brass fitting from the top of the engine behind the rear China wall, before attempting to remove the motor. This will ensure the fitting doesn't break off accidentally (a common occurrence).
Don't buy any parts until after you tear it down for inspection and measurements to determine the engine's state of wear and whether any machine shop work will be necessary. That way you procure the parts you actually need in a cost effective manner and avoid unnecessary delays waiting to exchange stuff you can't use. Take plenty of pictures as you progress to help with reassembly.
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When I pulled mine 350 with a standard el-cheapo hoist I had lots of clearance.
I put it back in with the transmission in place, and removed the tires entirely, and lowered the front axle onto wooden blocks to maximize clearance. Again I had lots of room. I found the added benefit of raising the truck to the engine after everything cleared allowed for some nice maneuvering.
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Don't buy any parts until after you tear it down for inspection and measurements to determine the engine's state of wear and whether any machine shop work will be necessary. That way you procure the parts you actually need in a cost effective manner and avoid unnecessary delays waiting to exchange stuff you can't use. Take plenty of pictures as you progress to help with reassembly.
X2, you don't want a rebuild kit with standard cylinders and find that a cylinder wall is scored up bad enough that your rebuild will be for nothing.
I would just plain bring the bare block and heads to a machine shop that does engine work, and have them go through them. Same with the crankshaft if you plan on reusing it. I consider this the hardest part of the build-making sure the base is rebuildable, something I would have more experienced hands look at for a first rebuild. And don't be afraid to ask them what they did and why, a good machine shop will be completely honest, and not do more then needed.
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Hey everyone update for today!
Its out!!
I finally got it out 😅 and am currently disassembling the motor and have made some interesting discoveries
1: my flex plate was cracked in THREE SPOTS
2: I have a 4 bolt main
Here's some pictures for today
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20170510/d358077d9a30ba1a51bce5157f74e3dd.jpg)
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20170510/1db365af20a11f0dc3b6a213af1e6a3e.jpg)
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20170510/33c37d862d18077ea9bff5d400e71f18.jpg)
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20170510/8f81cbc848ac8abc34510cad6294cb7b.jpg)
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20170510/4a878068a235c9e264f8fe1e8743353e.jpg)
Will continue to update
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a good habit to be in is to tape off or shove a CLEAN rag into any open ports on the engine to prevent debris or critters from making their way in and making a mess, much more important on the reassembly but still a good habit to be in.e
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First off, I order all my engine parts from Competition Products....they have a huge selection and cheapest prices. I like Jegs too, and Jegs will price match, but CP has a wider selection.
I like Clevite 77 or King bearings. Usually buy Hastings rings, although I really want to try some of the "total seal" rings. I like Felpro gaskets and particularly like the PN: 1003 head gaskets. If you're going back with a Hyd flat tapper cam, I'd go with a direct lube cam kit from competition products....I believed they're Howard's or Elgin brand? Anyway they guarantee the cam kit for Luke 5 years.
A tip I've learned, is if you install your own cam bearings (or tell the shop) I like to install mine at the 3:00 postition. Your bearings wear most from 3:00-9:00 because of all the down forces. Well your cam spins clockwise (looking at front) so if they're installed to spec at 6:00 (dead bottom) the oil won't Elantra to spread to the drivers side as well. If you install the bearings at 3:00 then the oil naturally wants to run down hill and it'll be getting pulled that way due to cam rotation anyway.
Also the rear freeze plug behind the cam, doesn't need to go in until it hits the came bearing. This forces the cam forward and also causes the plug to wear. I've pulled apart at least two engines that almost totally wore through the rear plug because of that.
Use quality assembly lube and clean everything well with something like Wd-40, to get all the dirt/grit from honing out of there. It also helps things not to flash rust.
Again these are my opinions, but it has all worked for me. Good luck!
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Also, measure everything a couple times. Get a mic/caliper and some Plasti-gauge. The firsts motor I ever built, I read the mic wrong and ruining the bearings. Also I like the permatex ultra's for sealants. It doesn't stink like the regular and the untra supposedly has better oil resistance. Use rubber gaskets when available. And if you need a new oil pan, Moroso has been the highest quality I've used. I got a factory replacement Zinc coated one. It was awesome. Has a better oil drain bung/plug so you can actually drain every drop and even had a magnetic plug with copper washer. It had the flattest, most true fit of any I've used.
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Also, measure everything a couple times. Get a mic/caliper and some Plasti-gauge. The firsts motor I ever built, I read the mic wrong and ruining the bearings. Also I like the permatex ultra's for sealants. It doesn't stink like the regular and the untra supposedly has better oil resistance. Use rubber gaskets when available. And if you need a new oil pan, Moroso has been the highest quality I've used. I got a factory replacement Zinc coated one. It was awesome. Has a better oil drain bung/plug so you can actually drain every drop and even had a magnetic plug with copper washer. It had the flattest, most true fit of any I've used.
Thanks for all the tips it helps a lot 😁 Some thing's I did want to pick up were a MSD distributor, I was probably gonna get a new can but not sure yet which one but I'll check out the one you recommended. I wanted to get a new holley 770 street avenger carb but that'll probably have to wait haha.
I usually do use jegs but I'm open to any reliable parts so I'll be sure to check out these other shops. Well today I'm taking heads off and can hopefully finish disassembly. I have to borrow all the specialty tools from a friend because all my tools got stolen a while back :/ but ya thanks again everyone and happy wrenching!
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I usually use Jegs too....they price match anything and it gets to my door next day, since I live in southern Ohio. BUT competition products has a way bigger engine parts selection and they're they only ones I've seen carry the direct lube cam kits with the warranty. The engine parts Catania about an inch thick. Anytime I'm placing an entire parts order, they're who I use. Anything else, I use Jegs. You definitely do not want to re-use a cam or lifters. It's almost mandatory to replace them, if they've got any mileage on them at all.
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I usually use Jegs too....they price match anything and it gets to my door next day, since I live in southern Ohio. BUT competition products has a way bigger engine parts selection and they're they only ones I've seen carry the direct lube cam kits with the warranty. The engine parts Catania about an inch thick. Anytime I'm placing an entire parts order, they're who I use. Anything else, I use Jegs. You definitely do not want to re-use a cam or lifters. It's almost mandatory to replace them, if they've got any mileage on them at all.
Its funny you say that because I just got about 6 lifters out, they're all kinda stuck, and I discovered one collapsed lifter. I am trying to get the others out but its proving to be a bit tougher haha. I'm keep seeing if I can get them out
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Not trying to hy-jack your thread vjfelix55 but I'm in the same boat and want to ask a question while we're on the topic.
On a mild/stock rebuild does the rotating assembly need to be balanced? Seems like all the hot rod guys say yes but I suspect it's not the case on engines that are not being reved all that much.
K
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So its done! The engine is completely disassembled. Heres what pictures I got so far:
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20170513/e9e971d7b0448312e1c27412f9a8a76a.jpg)
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20170513/d04b6b1e6d6297cfc450b6086e43757f.jpg)
I discovered 1 collapsed lifter
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20170513/6462f5854c6fdfa250c08c6cc444397b.jpg)
Here's all the top end parts of the engine + oil pan and misc items
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20170513/b9634adfad860985d3e2ca5337e56ecd.jpg)
Here's all the valve train and rotating assembly pieces
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20170513/9420586c414b9e9cfe4ba4f9c0b743ec.jpg)
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20170513/5b31a7c7c1f4412d17c9093b71b49ac7.jpg)
I also noticed one lobe on the cam was completely shot
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20170513/8f5df285ed9c5bd08fbf8e5d3264f15d.jpg)
And last but not least I noticed unusual wear on the last piston or piston 8, what could've caused this?
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20170513/92f108bbe5b2a3890a9c87e610127506.jpg)
But ya its finally done, now I build some more money up get the heads rebuilt block re honed and when its all clean and bada** I put it back together 😁
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Not trying to hy-jack your thread vjfelix55 but I'm in the same boat and want to ask a question while we're on the topic.
On a mild/stock rebuild does the rotating assembly need to be balanced? Seems like all the hot rod guys say yes but I suspect it's not the case on engines that are not being reved all that much.
K
No problem bro, since I'm going with a stock rebuild I was told I dont need to get it balanced but I'm not 100% sure if its true.
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That's not a collapsed lifter. A collapsed lifter is a lifter that has hydraulic internal failure. The foot of the lifter and lobe are wiped out. Common problem with modern oils. Judging by the wear on those pistons I would suggest having the machine shop bore the cylinders and match with appropriate oversized pistons.
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That's not a collapsed lifter. A collapsed lifter is a lifter that has hydraulic internal failure. The foot of the lifter and lobe are wiped out. Common problem with modern oils. Judging by the wear on those pistons I would suggest having the machine shop bore the cylinders and match with appropriate oversized pistons.
Could this be also due to the engine having a lot of miles on it, rather than because of the oil?
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That's not a collapsed lifter. A collapsed lifter is a lifter that has hydraulic internal failure. The foot of the lifter and lobe are wiped out. Common problem with modern oils. Judging by the wear on those pistons I would suggest having the machine shop bore the cylinders and match with appropriate oversized pistons.
Could this be also due to the engine having a lot of miles on it, rather than because of the oil?
According to my odometer I had about 110k but when I got the truck there was no speed cable so idk how true or accurate that is
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If these are stock heads, then i'm willing to bet any wear is more due to miles than oil.
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Yep, just a high mileage small block....looks like every stock one I've ever torn apart. If the cylinders aren't scratched I'd just hone them. The engin my truck was absent work out. The cylinders were all outside the limits of what most people would leave. BUT when I built it, it was for a derby car....I wanted it built "loose" so that it wouldn't seize from overheating. It's got pistons from 2-3 engines because so many were worn. And two pistons are technically in the wrong side. Lasted a long time. I swapped the heads and now it's in my 86 K20, but it needs rebuilding.
Wipe the cylinders down and take some pics. If they're within spec and aren't scratched I'd hone them and either buy a rebuild kit with new pistons or replace the one that's worn.