Author Topic: Not getting gas in carb  (Read 28915 times)

Offline MayheM

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Re: Not getting gas in carb
« Reply #45 on: June 19, 2014, 08:45:49 PM »
I have an update and I'm not sure if I should start a new thread since this isn't about the carb anymore, but here goes.

I got to work on it finally this week, got the passenger side head off and moved on to the drivers side head today. I have the header off, plugs out, valve cover off, and all of the head bolts out.. but it wouldn't budge. It looks like there is a bolt in the bracket right in front of the head(holding what i think is power steering fluid), which is also connected to the pulley bracket. I can't tell for sure if this bolt is in the head, but it sure looks like it. Am i going to have to remove the pulley system and all of that to get my driver's side head off? I can't see any other way to get the bolt out. I know a picture would be helpful, I'll go outside and take one now.

Thanks for all the help

2 Pics of bolt, 1 of engine
http://imgur.com/JyVGUq5,MXg02Iz,wqPPbI2

Edit: added a link to the pics of the bolt I'm asking about and a picture of what the inside of the engine looks like. The pictures were too big to upload here, sorry about that. I've cleaned the water or whatever it is out of the cylinders and oiled them/covered them to try to prevent rusting.
« Last Edit: June 19, 2014, 09:02:30 PM by MayheM »

Offline bd

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Re: Not getting gas in carb
« Reply #46 on: June 19, 2014, 09:16:29 PM »
You need to remove the power steering pump and brackets in front of the left (driver side) cylinder head.  You may be able to unbolt the pump and set it out of the way without disconnecting the lines.  Just make sure it doesn't lay against the radiator fins or it will bend them over.

There's no longer any question of whether you had water in the oil - the proof is in the mayonnaise.
Rich
It's difficult to know just how much you don't know until you know it.
In other words... if people learn by making mistakes, by now I should know just about everything!!!
87 R10 Silverado Fleetside 355 MPFI 700R4 3.42 Locker (aka Rusty, aka Mater)

Offline MayheM

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Re: Not getting gas in carb
« Reply #47 on: June 19, 2014, 09:21:49 PM »
You need to remove the power steering pump and brackets in front of the left (driver side) cylinder head.  You may be able to unbolt the pump and set it out of the way without disconnecting the lines.  Just make sure it doesn't lay against the radiator fins or it will bend them over.

There's no longer any question of whether you had water in the oil - the proof is in the mayonnaise.

Haha thanks for the laugh. Yeah I knew there was from draining it and looking at the new oil i had in it. I've kept all the rods in order of removal. What should i do to inspect/clean them properly? Also what would you guys recommend for cleaning the intake? Because it's pretty grimy. Also will soaking up that oil on the block w/ rags be good enough or do I need to clean it with something?

Lastly, once I get the other head off and find a machine shop.. what exactly should I ask them to do? Or should I just go off of their recommendations?

Thanks for the time and sorry if I asked too many questions at once!

Offline bd

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Re: Not getting gas in carb
« Reply #48 on: June 20, 2014, 02:36:31 AM »
That's not the original motor.  What's the mileage on the odometer? 

Did you check timing chain play before tear-down?  What was the engine oil pressure?  Aside from the oil/water emulsion, the valley appears relatively clean.  Mop up the mocha and wipe the valley down with clean rags.  Augment the cleanup with a little carb spray if you like. 

I'll try to help you get your arms around this....

Before you dump any money into machine work, remove and inspect the valve lifters one-at-a-time, keeping them strictly in order so each can be reinserted into the same lifter bore from which it was removed.  You absolutely do not want to mix the lifters up between bores/cam lobes or you'll destroy an otherwise good cam!  The lifter feet should appear slightly convex-to-flat and show no signs of pitting or galling.  If the lifter feet are concave, pitted or galled, they are worn out and you should add the cost of a replacement cam, lifters and double roller timing chain set to your shopping list.

Similarly, keep the valve pushrods and rocker arms in order.  Wash the pushrod center holes with carb spray followed by compressed air.  Check the pushrods for straightness by rolling across a table or other flat surface; inspect the pushrod ends for uneven wear.  Inspect the wear surfaces of the rocker arms.

Post a few clear, close-up pics of the cylinder walls with the pistons down.  Are there vertical striations (scuffs) in the cylinder walls?  Do the walls appear shiny and polished?  Look very closely for cracks in the walls.  Are there concentric grooves around the tops of the cylinders?  If there are problems with the cylinder walls you should seriously consider installing a crate engine rather than rebuilding yours.

Talk to your machine shop and explain what happened then request an estimate from them for cylinder head repair that includes hot-tanking, magnafluxing, surfacing, grinding the valves and seats, checking the guides, and installing press-on Viton valve guide seals in addition to any recommendations they make as a result of their tear-down.

If the engine had good oil pressure before you tore it down, the bottom end is probably still okay with an oil and filter change.  If not, you've essentially escalated into a major overhaul.  You get the idea? 

Do your best to determine overall engine condition and get a complete picture of what you are facing, so you can take the best repair approach for minimal cost.  There is a point beyond which you are money ahead to install a new motor that carries a warranty.  So, take the time to perform a complete evaluation before committing your cash.
Rich
It's difficult to know just how much you don't know until you know it.
In other words... if people learn by making mistakes, by now I should know just about everything!!!
87 R10 Silverado Fleetside 355 MPFI 700R4 3.42 Locker (aka Rusty, aka Mater)

Offline MayheM

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Re: Not getting gas in carb
« Reply #49 on: June 20, 2014, 07:10:19 PM »
That's not the original motor.  What's the mileage on the odometer? 

Did you check timing chain play before tear-down?  What was the engine oil pressure?  Aside from the oil/water emulsion, the valley appears relatively clean.  Mop up the mocha and wipe the valley down with clean rags.  Augment the cleanup with a little carb spray if you like. 

I'll try to help you get your arms around this....

Before you dump any money into machine work, remove and inspect the valve lifters one-at-a-time, keeping them strictly in order so each can be reinserted into the same lifter bore from which it was removed.  You absolutely do not want to mix the lifters up between bores/cam lobes or you'll destroy an otherwise good cam!  The lifter feet should appear slightly convex-to-flat and show no signs of pitting or galling.  If the lifter feet are concave, pitted or galled, they are worn out and you should add the cost of a replacement cam, lifters and double roller timing chain set to your shopping list.

Similarly, keep the valve pushrods and rocker arms in order.  Wash the pushrod center holes with carb spray followed by compressed air.  Check the pushrods for straightness by rolling across a table or other flat surface; inspect the pushrod ends for uneven wear.  Inspect the wear surfaces of the rocker arms.

Post a few clear, close-up pics of the cylinder walls with the pistons down.  Are there vertical striations (scuffs) in the cylinder walls?  Do the walls appear shiny and polished?  Look very closely for cracks in the walls.  Are there concentric grooves around the tops of the cylinders?  If there are problems with the cylinder walls you should seriously consider installing a crate engine rather than rebuilding yours.

Talk to your machine shop and explain what happened then request an estimate from them for cylinder head repair that includes hot-tanking, magnafluxing, surfacing, grinding the valves and seats, checking the guides, and installing press-on Viton valve guide seals in addition to any recommendations they make as a result of their tear-down.

If the engine had good oil pressure before you tore it down, the bottom end is probably still okay with an oil and filter change.  If not, you've essentially escalated into a major overhaul.  You get the idea? 

Do your best to determine overall engine condition and get a complete picture of what you are facing, so you can take the best repair approach for minimal cost.  There is a point beyond which you are money ahead to install a new motor that carries a warranty.  So, take the time to perform a complete evaluation before committing your cash.

I'll check the odometer when i go back out after dinner. No I didn't check the timing chain, I completely forgot until i was reading through the thread again yesterday. Also i never looked to see what the oil pressure was.

I got the driver's side head off about 30 mins ago. I took a pic of the gasket, it didn't seem that bad, there was a little tear between the middle cylinders. I pulled some of the lifters out that were up a bit so I could grab them, and took some pics that I will upload after i type this up. I'll inspect the cylinders tomorrow in better light and the pushrods aswell. If everything checks out I'll then get in contact w/ a machine shop. If not I'll look at my other options.

I feel like an idiot for not knowing what the oil pressure was, it just never crossed my mind to check.

Thanks for the detailed help again man, I'll try my best to follow it exactly this time and not forget to check things. I know it must be annoying to advise me to do something before teardown and then I don't.

EDIT: Here is a link to the pics, I only took 4 lifters out, I just took multiple pics of each of the 4(didn't remember which was which so i just put them all in the album).
http://imgur.com/a/iB6em
« Last Edit: June 20, 2014, 07:26:00 PM by MayheM »

Offline LeftysRodandCustom

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Re: Not getting gas in carb
« Reply #50 on: June 24, 2014, 01:27:37 PM »
New is new man, dont sweat a couple mistakes. One thing i'd add to what bd said is that even if the bottom end appears to be fine, if you've got the motor out and the pan off, change the oil pump. If you dont end up pulling it out then it'd be quite a chore but if you do, the oil pump is cheap insurance since you dont know the mileage. The gasket failure between the center cylinders is not in the least bit a surprise. Thats where you have two exhaust ports side by side, and thus a lot of heat. This is part of the reason for the LT1 having a reverse flow water pump in later years.