73-87chevytrucks.com
General Site Info => General Discussion => Topic started by: 2502 on November 04, 2011, 09:34:02 pm
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it's a 95 burban, but this is the first place i could think of to post.
fuel pump went out last week, so i finally got around today to dropping the tank and replacing the pump. fought with it for a while but eventually got it up and in, and it wasn't easy taking the tank out by myself i really could've used two more arms.
anyways, get it in, put some gas in the tank, turn the key to on, hear the new pump kick on. engine cranks, but won't turn over. it sounds like it's TRYING to, but it won't start the whole way. had a friend come check it out before the daylight ran out, he sprayed some starting fluid in the intake, and it fired up, then died. after trying that, it fired up again, and then died. then wouldn't start back up at all.
i'm lost. i keep thinking i must be overlooking something stupid, but i can't figure it out.
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If it cranks then it is turning over. I think you are trying to say it cranks but won't run. If you hear the fuel pump and you have fuel in it check the fuel pressure. Did you eliminate the fuel pump pulsator? They rupture and blast fuel into the tank. Replace it with a piece of hose instead. It should have came with the new pump. Also make sure you didn't kink any lines.
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haha yeah that's what i mean sorry i'm exhausted and partially brain dead. and no honestly i don't know what the pulsator even looks like? the new pump came with the rubber rings, clips and wires for a new ground and some plastic clamps for the rubber that it connects to. i dont see any lines kinked i was careful putting it back in which was a real pain in.
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See image, hose vs pulsator
(http://www.syphoon.com/albums/SYCLONE-2932/IMG_0236.sized.jpg)
Just google it and you'll see images of ruptured units.
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Can't add anything to that but how have you been doing?
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vile i did't see a pulsator anywhere. i'll try to post the pic of what was there when i pulled the old pump out...
kaos, i'm doing. i haven't been on in a while and had to give up the truck project. i actually started selling out the parts i stockpiled off of it tonight and that put me in a foul mood. but i don't think i even posted when the engine got stolen and stuff i haven't been on here in so long.
health wise i'm still maintaining. i had to have another surgery to remove the rest of the lymph nodes in my neck in april, and added a sexy scar to the ever growing collection. i'm glad women like scars man haha. i kinda decided to avoid the radiation therapy for future occruances and just opted to have them cut it out. i recover quick after surgery than i do from the radiation that wipes me out. thanks for asking tho haha
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Good to hear!
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(http://api.plixi.com/api/tpapi.svc/imagefromurl?size=medium&url=http%3A%2F%2Flockerz.com%2Fs%2F153341282)
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vile does this even have that part?
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Yes. Its your sending unit.
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vile does this even have that part?
No,
Looks like it's been eliminated by the piece of 3/8" hose. That's a good thing. Did you replace the hose and clamps when you put the new one in? Check your fuel pressure.
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yeah i did. i used all the new stuff that it gave me with the pump. replaced that hose and put the clamps on, they only go on so tight.
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Did you check the fuel pressure?
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not yet i just got home from dc a few minutes ago. i'm gonna take a nap and then check it.
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ok i couldn't find my gauge to check the pressure. but i replaced the fuel filter, checked the lines running up to the tbi, and it seems like it's blocked there somewhere.
we took everything apart, and my friend tried cleaning the fuel injectors but it's leaking fuel all over the place when we tried to put it together. replaced the gasket, still leaking all around the injectors now. WTH!
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(http://c0014029.r32.cf1.rackcdn.com/x2_92cad6a)
i gave up tonight cuz it got dark early and cold quick. i'm frustrated and ready to set it on fire.
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so where did the fuel stop flowing to?
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you got me. the truck just died at the gas station one night, wouldn't start back up.
it seemed to be a fuel issue, so i checked the fuel pump and couldn't hear it click on so i replaced the pump. now it's working fine, gas is getting all the way up front but it's not starting still. so we pulled it apart and cleaned the injectors, and now it's dumping fuel. when i turn the ignition. it didn't seem like the gasket sealed right so we redid the gasket so i'll try it again tmorrow when there's light
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checked the fuel injectors, not sure how to test if they're not working or what...
the gas was coming TO the injectors but still doesn't seem to wanna start up.
any suggestions?
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Is it still leaking?
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no when bill put the injectors back in he missed the o rings. i just bought the gasket kit and we replaced those so no leak. it starts up, and dies.
it was leaking around the injectors, so the fuel is at least getting there, just past that i can't figure out what to check test or replace. and i'm trying to have a better guess since i'm on a limited budget now to fix it
(http://a2.sphotos.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-ash4/s720x720/379044_10150437837664434_642429433_10208970_1928424449_n.jpg)
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will it run on carb clean?
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I am betting on the regulator/Diaphram and the lack of fuel pressure...
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if it sits for a few minutes, it starts up normal, then dies out right away. i'm thinking pressure. but i'm an idiot and know nothing i'm just thinking if this were the problem on my bike, it would most likely be this:\
friend of mine thinks it's the injectors, which are like $80 a piece, i had a ton of stuff for my 79 that was still brand new so i returned it to get credit to get the injectors, and one location had one, another location had another. so i grabbed one, we drove to the other one, and it's the wrong injector in the right box. so now i have to wait for one to come in.
i still think it's pressure related. i never checked the fuel pressure cuz i didn't have the gauge to do so. i mean it's getting gas up to the tbi, and it seems to stop at the injectors. when we overlooked the missing o rings at the top it was spilling down in there so it's getting fuel it's just not doing anything past that point.
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Pinch the rubber return hose off and see what happens
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Pinch the rubber return hose off and see what happens
and see if it doens't start or what would i be looking for?
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Pinching the return hose will increase the fuel pressure on the supply side so if you have a bad regulator bleeding off the pressure this should negate it... Or if you have a leak, this will expose it.
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ok thanks i'll try that tomorrow when we got some light. i just want the thing to run i'm falling behind on t shirts i have to print with no truck to get back and forth to the shop
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during troubleshooting today, hooked up a 9volt batt to the injectors.
they sprayed just fine, truck started up. so my injectors aren't getting power from.... __________?
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The ECM triggers the Injectors to fire. Do you have anything disconnected? Any broken/frayed wires?. The injectors are tied into the fuel pump and oil pressure switch, are you gettting oil pressure? Is it connected? The only other thing I could thing of it the ignition module.
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are you gettting oil pressure?
Good point there Capt. I fixed the same problem once with a few qts. of oil.
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The ECM triggers the Injectors to fire. Do you have anything disconnected? Any broken/frayed wires?. The injectors are tied into the fuel pump and oil pressure switch, are you gettting oil pressure? Is it connected? The only other thing I could thing of it the ignition module.
we went thru it today to doublecheck connections and didn't SEE any wires disconnected or frayed, melted etc. when it starts up, nothing abnormal shows in my oil pressure gauge, so i'm lost. i was thinking maybe the ecm died.
but the fuel pump DID die too, i just didn't think it was coincidental that both of them went together. i mean who knows it's an old truck. my friend initially thought maybe the injectors were out but they spray when they have power to them so i'm assuming it's maybe the ecm.
anyway to test either one to eliminate them before i start replacing stuff again that's not broke? lol
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You need to verify your fuel pressure and check for injector pulse. If you have correct fuel pressure and no injector pulse you can do a few easy pinpoint tests. Did you check your fuel pressure? Do you have a test light or noid lights?
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You need to verify your fuel pressure and check for injector pulse. If you have correct fuel pressure and no injector pulse you can do a few easy pinpoint tests. Did you check your fuel pressure? Do you have a test light or noid lights?
no i don't have any of that... maybe i can get a friend that has test lights to come thru and check it out
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ok tell me what tests to run and i'll do it when my friend gets off work and can give me a hand with the stuff i dn't know how to do
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are you gettting oil pressure?
Good point there Capt. I fixed the same problem once with a few qts. of oil.
What did you do that to that fixed the problem?
ok tell me what tests to run and i'll do it when my friend gets off work and can give me a hand with the stuff i dn't know how to do
Verify spark (do you know how to do this?)
Verify injector pulse ( Test light to ground, key on engine off, unplug one injector connector. One terminal should have B+. Now probe the other terminal with the test light connected to B+. Have an assistant crank the engine. Test light should blink
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are you gettting oil pressure?
Good point there Capt. I fixed the same problem once with a few qts. of oil.
What did you do that to that fixed the problem?
ok tell me what tests to run and i'll do it when my friend gets off work and can give me a hand with the stuff i dn't know how to do
Verify spark (do you know how to do this?)
Verify injector pulse ( Test light to ground, key on engine off, unplug one injector connector. One terminal should have B+. Now probe the other terminal with the test light connected to B+. Have an assistant crank the engine. Test light should blink
i gotta get a test light mine is missing from teh garage go figure.
i'm gonna try this tomorrow i didn't have the extra body to try things out today. i swear it's probably something simple and i just don't know enuff about this stuff to get it right.
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are you gettting oil pressure?
Good point there Capt. I fixed the same problem once with a few qts. of oil.
What did you do that to that fixed the problem?
The oil pressure switch shut the fuel pump off.
The truck would run for a short time and die. I noticed it was 2.5qts low on oil after I added oil it didn't die any more.
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Thirsty,
The oil pressure switch doesn't shut down the fuel pump, it enables it. In the event that the fuel pump relay fails, the oil pressure switch would provide a back feed to the fuel pump. So what you'd get is an extended crank but it would still run. You probably had a problem with the fuel pump circuit. Many people think the oil pressure was a protective series circuit but it wasn't. You could drain the oil and it should still start and run.
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since it was sitting, i did change the oil. that didn't make a diff it still starts up if it's sat, then dies right after.
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dont know why I didnt see this but just now realized its for a 95, are you saying it will start up but will die within seconds. if this is the case a couple things to try would be the pick-up coil or icm. kind of leaning towards the icm, the ecm primes the pump which is why you hear it run from the start, then the ecm waits for a pulse from the icm to keep the pump running, if the icm is good i think you can test them at the parts store then the only thing else i can think of is the pick-up coil i dont know why but for some reason its staying in my head as a possible problem kind of a hunch i hate to suggest something on a hunch but what the heck lol
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You're right Irish,
It could be many things including the icm but with a few simple tests he can avoid throwing parts at it uneccessarily.
You need to verify fuel pressure, spark and injector pulse for any of us to really help you out here unless you're willing to just throw parts at it.
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yeah wasting money sucks ::)
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i was away all weekend and hopefully today a friend is coming to check the fuel pressure i'll let you know in a few hrs
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Thirsty,
The oil pressure switch doesn't shut down the fuel pump, it enables it. In the event that the fuel pump relay fails, the oil pressure switch would provide a back feed to the fuel pump. So what you'd get is an extended crank but it would still run. You probably had a problem with the fuel pump circuit. Many people think the oil pressure was a protective series circuit but it wasn't. You could drain the oil and it should still start and run.
I stand corrected.
Years ago I was told that the oil pressure switch would shut the pump down to protect the motor by someone that I thought I could believe. I was sold on the theory without ever looking into it, even more so when adding oil to that 90' chevy made it stay running.
The best part of this forum is that you get tons of advise and people like Vile will take the time to explain things to everybody when advise is not accurate for your situation.
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Thirsty,
The oil pressure switch doesn't shut down the fuel pump, it enables it. In the event that the fuel pump relay fails, the oil pressure switch would provide a back feed to the fuel pump. So what you'd get is an extended crank but it would still run. You probably had a problem with the fuel pump circuit. Many people think the oil pressure was a protective series circuit but it wasn't. You could drain the oil and it should still start and run.
I stand corrected.
Years ago I was told that the oil pressure switch would shut the pump down to protect the motor by someone that I thought I could believe. I was sold on the theory without ever looking into it, even more so when adding oil to that 90' chevy made it stay running.
The best part of this forum is that you get tons of advise and people like Vile will take the time to explain things to everybody when advise is not accurate for your situation.
definitely.
my issue is i'm trapped at home, everyone i know works some ridiculous schedule so trying to find a ride is a real pain and i have to be in the gym for a set time during the days so i'm like... stuck. luckily the gym is across the street from my house so...
i dont have the tools to check the fuel pressure so i'm gonna trty to get a ride up to auto zone or something sinc ei know they do loner tools
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yeah and then they wont say "well only one of the things you stated is correct" ::)
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truck is running. bit rough, i cussed at it and threw my helmet at the truck after i posted last. seems like it could use new plugs and wires which i'll prob do this week when i get paid. it started up magically after not wanting to for 2 weeks. i'm not complaining. it's running, so i guess a tuneup is in order now??!
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Not to thread hijack but my 94 is almost doing the same thing was running fine before I went into the store now when I started it up it ran very low rpms for about 5 sec. The dies now nothing. I can hear the injectors click but don't hear the pump. Check fuel pump fuse its good. Tried the relay but don't have anything to replace it with so I tapped it with a pair of cuffs. Don't have any tools lol but didn't do anything. So I went to dollar tree and looked for starting fluid or wd40 they didn't have neither so I got some injector cleaner and dumped it into the TB started up till that ran dry then died.
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Fuel Pump. Have someone turn the key to the on position while you hit on the tank.
Sometimes that works, short term.
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Not to thread hijack but my 94 is almost doing the same thing was running fine before I went into the store now when I started it up it ran very low rpms for about 5 sec. The dies now nothing. I can hear the injectors click but don't hear the pump. Check fuel pump fuse its good. Tried the relay but don't have anything to replace it with so I tapped it with a pair of cuffs. Don't have any tools lol but didn't do anything. So I went to dollar tree and looked for starting fluid or wd40 they didn't have neither so I got some injector cleaner and dumped it into the TB started up till that ran dry then died.
Smack the gas tank with a hammer a few times.
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well had it loaded up shortly after posting. went back to my buddys house attempted to get the truck off the trailer we dont this many times before but this was a different trailer not the one we built and the dang truck falls off the ramp and they have a bolt on the side of the ramp to lock it upright well the rear tire hit that putting a small but leaking gash in the tire it goes flat as soon as the front tire are off the ramp. im really ticked off at this point but all i can do is laugh at it and then we all start pointing fingers at whos fault it was lol but anyway bang on the tank turn the key on to hear the pump prim up, was happy then. so then i tried to start it and nothing was ticked again so i hit the tank a couple more times and tried to start it, she starts like nothing was ever wrong except for the flat tire lol. so does this mean the pump is shot eclectically or it sucked up some crap and that ruined it or the couple hours it sat the pump cooled down ?
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Time for a new pump!
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lol this is known but just want to know why it failed
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To really know why it failed you will need an oscilloscope and an amp clamp. Got one? ;)
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um lol got one but not both