73-87chevytrucks.com
73-87 Chevy _ GMC Trucks => Performance => Topic started by: nlauffer on May 28, 2013, 11:33:27 am
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I know I have posted an engine question before and I have read some cam and head discussions, but here it is again.
I have my 1972 2 bolt main 350 block on the engine stand. It has been bored .040, and crankshaft turned 10/10. It has stock rods with new stock rod bolts and stock style dished hypertectic pistons. Unfortunately, the motor sat unassembled for 10-15 years.
The block just needs cleaned and I'm thinking about zero decking it. I don't know if it will be worth it, though.
The crank was stored with a coating used to seal up alcohol injection system. After that long of being stored it appears to have penetrated the coating. My question is, turning a stock GM crank to 20/20 costs about $75, but a new Scat costs $199. Is it considerably beneficial to purchase a new crank or save a few bucks and refresh mine?
The pistons and rods have been soaking in WD40 because they are somewhat seized up. I have been able to released them all. I was thinking about replacing the bolts with ARP wavelocks. Also, I thought about flat top pistons.
Now for an explaination of what I am building. This will be a street driven daily driver. Not much highway time and probably never on a track. The truck already has 3.73s I believe. If it has 3.42 I'll be happy, but if lower than that they will get changed to 3.73. The Th350 will stay for awhile. Maybe in the future a 700R4 will go back in. Not until I get some more money though.
The top end I have narrowed it down to is a set of straight plug 190cc runner Pro Comp aluminum heads with 64cc chamber. The cam I want is the Lunati 10120702:
•Advertised Duration (Int/Exh): 262/268
•Duration @ .050 (Int/Exh): 219/227
•Gross Valve Lift (Int/Exh): .468/.489
•LSA/ICL: 112/108
•RPM Range: 1400-5800
I am not sure what the dish is exactly on these pistons, but it should put me around 9.5:1. I could be wrong, though. This is why I was thinking about zero decking the block.
I will probably be using headers, but I kinda want to use stock exhaust manifolds. If I use stock manifolds, I am going to try to find some HO Camaro/Firebird manifolds. I believe they are 2.5" output. If I stick with headers, I would like to use the ball & socket flange. I don't want cheapos, but I don't want to spend $600 either. Ceramic coated would be preferred. Has anyone used this header? What brand, price, and vehicle fitment. I know some have used mid length headers.
Carburetion is unknown at this time. Quick Fuel makes a 680cfm Slayer that is supposed to be hot rod friendly. My other option is the Street Demon 625cfm. Let me know if anyone has used these specifically.
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Update:
I dropped off the block, crank, pistons & rods at the machine shop to get cleaned up. While talking to him we decided he would clean everything and check clearances. He said the crank looks like a polish will clean it up. I decided not to get a new crank at this time.
When I asked him to deck the block, his response was: save some money and use thinner head gaskets. He said he would make sure the surface was true, but his opinion on this build was to use a .015 gasket. I like the idea and think it makes more sense. Some times I just have to here it from someone else or I'll take off down the wrong path.
As far as ARP bolts. He said the rod bolts look like stock replacements. I think I am starting to decide how to build this engine for real now. I had all these grand ideas in my head, but once the work starts, reality comes to the front.
Before I left, I asked him about heads. I saw some in the customer section, but none anywhere else. He doesn't usually build to sell he said, but he has a set of RHS 180cc runner 64cc chamber heads that where given to him and another customer wants. But, that other person hasn't been back for months. At $450 I told him I'd take em. Now I have to wait on him to decided whether the other guy will return. I think that says something about the business he runs.
Header or manifolds?? that debate still goes on. So does carb.
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It sounds like you found a reputable machine shop. All things being equal, I don't see a major issue with the thinner head gasket. If the block deck and head are straight, that shouldn't be a big issue. However, you may consider the costs associated with the gaskets versus decking the block and/or flat top pistons.
Do you know the "cc" on the piston dish? The volume of the piston and head will allow you to compute the actual compression ratio. With a stock deck height, you'll likely have some safety margin but may not gain the C/R you want. If the piston is below the deck height, then you will have the cc of the piston plus the cc of the volume to the deck plus the cc of the head to calculate the actual C/R.
Not racing and a daily driver, you will probably be fine with the stock replacement rod bolts.
Since you said the truck will be a driver, headers overall give more horsepower and torque, but can be more troublesome (especially with cheap headers). Manifolds are generally trouble free.
As for a carb, I prefer the Q-jet for gasoline. Other people will have other opinions. However, somewhere around 600 CFM will probably be adequate for your build.
Ultimately, the decision is based on what you want to build and how much you want to spend...
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Part of my problem with this build is that I don't know exactly what cc the pistons are. It was rebuilt 10-15 years ago and put away in storage torn back apart. They appear to be nothing special pistons. Some places I have found 7cc dish is standard and some kits have 12cc dish as standard. If it is the 12cc dish, that is where I want to try to make up in the deck or gasket. I have computed the numbers a few times, but I can't get anything for sure without knowing the dish and what I am losing in deck height. I have used some generic numbers, but even those I notice vary on deck height.
64cc heads are a must for me on this build. I am tired of low compression 76's.
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if your truck is an auto u may have to get a mild stall converter like a 2300-2500. and those heads should work well with that cam and add a nice dual plane intake with a 650 it should be torky
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There are ways to determine exactly what cc you have from the pistons. It can be tedious, but at the very least you can determine what volume you have to work with.
Essentially it involves assembling the short block on an engine stand, turn a cylinder bank to vertical, bring a piston to TDC.
Take a piece of plexiglass with a hole drilled through it, place plexiglass over the cylinder ( cylinder positioned in the vertical).
Fill a buret or graduated cylinder and write down the filled measurement. Carefully fill the cylinder with water from a buret or graduated cylinder through hole in plexiglass until cylinder is full to bottom of hole in plexiglass.
To determine the exact volume of the piston at TDC, subtract amount of water poured into cylinder from original amount in buret.
The same would apply to the cylinder heads. Decking the heads, valve jobs, etc can reduce or increase the advertised volume on a head. Checking to see exactly what you are dealing with can aid in determining the gaskets used and other build parameters.
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So it's been awhile, but I talked to the machinist a few days ago. He said between harvest and working on some irrigation motors he hadn't finished mine yet. Dang rural Kansas. Everything gets put on hold during harvest and the start of corn irrigating. He did say the crank will be fine, but he said the cylinders are too lose for the .040 pistons. It looked like someone re honed the cylinder to get rid of a little bit of ridge. He recommended going next oversize. I told him to go ahead. I asked about flat tops and he said it would be too much for anything other than stock cc heads. I told him that's what I thought but I was still wanting to buy the RHS heads he has. He told he probably would sell them to me. Still not a definite yes but I am starting to understand his personality now. I think when the day comes I will own them. So stock hypertectic it is. I'll find out what the dish is that way. I do like the idea of cc'ing the cylinder after short block is assembled. This way I get exact. He said I'd be around 9.5.
So with a .060 block, RHS 64cc 180cc intake heads, lunati cam (see above for specs), stock pistons (12cc I think), comp magnum roller tip 1.5 rockers, edelbrock or weiand dual plane intake, stock hei, stock qjet (most likely), stock manifolds, vortec serpentine belt setup, and worn th350 and 3.73 gears what can I look for in numbers.
Anything I'm forgetting or should change? I think this will be a much improved, reliable build. And cheap.
I currently have 3.08 gears but I have a set of 3.73 and install kit waiting for someone to put in. Any takers?
Also looking at a Chance transmission rebuild for $650-$800. $800 includes shift kit, hardened internals, extra clutch plate, and torque converter. I thought about going one step up on cam and upgrading to 2000-2200 stall.
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What are opinions on Lunati Voodoo cam?
What are opinions on RHS heads?
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Sorry so many back to back posts, but I like to hear ideas and opinions. I'm not an expert and can definitely use the help.
I have purchased the brackets froma Chevy dealer for a 98 Chevy serpentine setup. I still need a new AC compressor, alternator, water pump, power steering pump, and pulleys. The brackets aren't too expensive especially since I can't get anyone near me to sell me used stuff.
What kinds of issues am I looking at with this swap? I know I need to adapt AC lines and power steering lines and a reverse water pump which I believe takes slightly different heater hoses. What abou clearance issues? How do I upgrade alternator wiring for the 105 amp alt from the 60? Do I even need to?
I have seen you can just take new and old power steering lines and splice together. Is there another option?
Should I splice AC lines the same way? Do I need the newer style drier?
So many questions but I just am not sure.
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I built a 1996 Vortec motor for my 84 and put the serpentine system on it from the same motor. You can reuse the original power steering lines from your steering box, they with scerw right in to the new P/S pump, so no need for splicing. You can also use your original A/C lines, just mount then horizontally on the new compressor. I bought all new original style A/C components and everything bolted right together.
You will need an new lower radiator hose because the old one will contact the serpentine belt. If you install the old one, you will see where it needs to be straight instead of the bend that contacts the belt. Also get a thermostat housing for an early 90's truck, it will point away from the brackets and you can use your original top hose.For the alternator you only have to use your original heavy red wire and the small brown wire, the other red wire is not used. The heavy red goes to the large stud on back of the new alternator, the small brown connects to the second "pin" down from the top next to the locating "tooth." When you look inside the new alternator plug outlet you will see what I mean.
A/C you will have to search for a pigtail to adapt your old harness to the new A/C compressor.
You also have to make sure all the holes on the front of the heads are drilled and tapped to accept the serpentine system. if you use some Vortec heads they are already drilled. You may consider the Voretc's they are 64cc and could handle your cam with a little spring area work.
You will have the clearance the alternator bracket if you are wanting to use a Qjet and the original metal line from the mechanical pump.
On the new water pump, I just capped off the outlet I didnt use, it will make sense when you see it.
if you want you can call me 281-435-7843 Steve
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So my 83 GMC steering hoses will attach directly to the new 98 Chevy power steering pump. Also the AC lines from my 83 will work on the 98 AC compressor? Do you have a part number for the lower hose?
I am using RHS heads and believe they are already drilled and tapped for acc. mounting.
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I did the conversion to my 84, so it should be the same for your 83. Its a Dayco hose and I am looking for the part number.
I can take some pictures and send them to you if you want.
Alos, I would try to find all the stock bolts and fasteners for the serpentine system, it makes it A LOT easier......check ebay, be specific for a 98 system.
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Thanks, will do.
So with a .060 block, RHS 64cc 180cc intake heads, lunati cam (see above for specs), stock pistons (12cc I think), comp magnum roller tip 1.5 rockers, edelbrock or weiand dual plane intake, stock hei, stock qjet (most likely), stock manifolds, vortec serpentine belt setup, and worn th350 and 3.73 gears what can I look for in numbers.
Anything I'm forgetting or should change? I think this will be a much improved, reliable build. And cheap.
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Probably somewhere in the 300-325hp/ 380 ft lbs range.
Another thing to remember with a flat tappet camshaft, you will need a high zinc content oil. Without it you will be taking a chance on ruining to surfaces between the lifters and cam lobe. You can use an oil additive, I believe Comp Cams offers something and a few others.
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I was looking for something locally, but its just a small Napa store. What is your thought on running it long term versus during break in.
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Run Mobil1 10W30 with one bottle of ZDPPPlus per oil change, every 3000 miles.
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I really like Mobil 1, but I also like Royal Purple. My current motor gets the cheap stuff, it eats it too fast. Where do I get the ZDDP additive?
My thought was that if all motor oils are changing "ingredients" and an additive is needed for break in, then wouldn't be beneficial to run it all the time. I have read where others so there is no need to after break in. But, why?
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http://www.amazon.com/dp/B007X74HZW
Oil used to have more ZDPP (a.k.a. zinc). Problem is, it is hard on catalytic converters. So it was cut back in most oils. Modern engines with roller cams (actually, the rollers are on the bottoms of the lifters) don't need it. What the ZDPP does is form, under pressure, a protective coating on metal parts subjected to "wiping" motion, like cam lobes and lifter bottoms in older style flat-tappet engines. Too much ZDPP, though, causes pitting. Most oils now have about 800 ppm, pitting occurs above 2000 ppm. Also, the ZDPP is used up, as, when it bonds it is chemically changed, then it is wiped off and replaced with more. So that's why I say 3000 miles, so your ZDPP concentration doesn't fall too low for protection.
So, yeah, the short answer is that if it's a flat-tappet engine, use special oil or additive for more ZDPP all the time, if it's a roller engine, regular oil is fine.
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So what would be a good oil to use? Or do I just need to add ZDPP?
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You just need to add ZDPP to current common motor oils to regain the same protection those oils once provided to flat-tappet engines.
I prefer synthetic oils, and know several people who have gotten upwards of 250,000 miles out of gasoline engines using full-synthetic oils, which is pretty remarkable.
But for flat-tappet engines, even synthetic oils need higher levels of ZDPP than currently in the mix.
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Engine is almost done as of a couple weeks ago he just needed to assemble it. He also said he would put new springs on the RHS heads. I stopped by today but it was too late and he was closed. I hope it is done and he just hasn't called me yet.
I spoke with a guy today who closed an engine build shop a couple years ago. He has some lunati voodoo 60101 cams which is the step below what I want and be has some Holley street dominator dual plane intakes. I think we might do some trading and I will get them almost free. I think free is good even if it is a smaller cam. It is the one the Lunati tech recommended
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All in all I think going from a stockish 305 with 3.08 gears to a mild built 350 with 3.73 gears is going to be a huge change. I wouldn't be surprised if I double my horsepower and not sure about torque. Should be very fun and very street able. Serpentine belt setup is coming along a piece at a time. I am ripping into the truck right now replacing sheetmetal so the engine doesn't have to be ready right away. The rear end is gonna be fully removed to do the gear swap as I am lowering it 2.5/4 or so also. I have been tempted to remove the drivers side tank and go with a rear blazer tank. I don't want a bed floor fuel fill though. I would like to see a detailed taillight fuel filler or something in the bed side maybe.
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Oh yeah, a stage 2 rebuilt quadrajet is the final decision on carb. M
My workshop is starting to look like a parts store. I need to start getting some of the work done.
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Oh yeah, a stage 2 rebuilt quadrajet is the final decision on carb. M
My workshop is starting to look like a parts store. I need to start getting some of the work done.
Who's doing the carb?
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Sean Murphy Induction. SMIcarburetor.com. I have hear a lot of good things about them. I will send mine off and for $269 it'll get an amazing looking and performing build.
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Sean Murphy Induction. SMIcarburetor.com. I have hear a lot of good things about them. I will send mine off and for $269 it'll get an amazing looking and performing build.
Excellent. I've talked to him, and am very impressed. The Quadrajet needs to be tuned to the engine and the induction and exhaust setup; it's not plug and play. And a lot of the tuning is drilling the proper size air bleeds in inserts in various passages and the like. I think Sean has basically set up Qjets for just about any situation over the years, with vehicle and instrumentation in hand, and kept all his notes. So he can get you to a proper tune on a Qjet for your vehicle pretty much no matter what it is and how it is set up.
Make sure he has the full scoop on how you are setting things up -- intake manifold, engine, heads, cam, exhaust -- and he can nail it.
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I just rode in an 84 Chevy K1500 with 33x12.50 tires, Chance built TH350, stock bottom end 350 (with stock dished pistons), vortec heads, headers, Edelbrock RPM Airgap, Holley ???cfm carb, aftermarket HEI, and a Comp Cams xtreme 4x4 270H cam (# 12-243-3).
The truck idles at 800 and sounds awesome. Put it in gear (cold) and it idles at 600 and sounds just as awesome. It has a cold stumble from the Holley, but you can tell it's got some power when you put your foot in it. Oh, yeah 3.73 gears. You can feel it in your stomach setting you back in the seat a little. Now it's no race care, but makes a great pulling truck. He uses it to pull his wrecker through the snow.
It's so close to the engine I am building, that I think I found my cam.
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That cam won't have a lot of torque in the bottom, with 50* of overlap, but it's a high-lift, high-flow cam that will punch out hp once it starts breathing, no doubt about that. Note rpm range of 1800-6000 and 2200+ rpm torque converter recommendation.
Maybe 430 lb-ft at 4000 and 380 hp at 5000 with headers, 390 lb-ft and 345 hp at the same rpms with a manifold.
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Comp 12-235-2 will give you 430 lb-ft at 3500 and 350 hp at 4500. You give up 30 hp on top, but the torque and hp peaks move 500 rpm down, and the torque comes on much earlier.
12-243-3 will give you 346 lb-ft at 1500, but 12-235-2 will give you 379 lb-ft at 1500.
I ran these for you just for grins. Download them so I can take them down, if you would.
http://users.rcn.com/weyand/smalls/12-243-3nlauffer.jpg
http://users.rcn.com/weyand/smalls/12-235-2nlauffer.jpg
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Downloaded. Thanks.
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Today was AWESOME!!! I got my short block (minus cam) and cylinder heads from the machinist. It has been since around June 1 or so. I also took the wife and kids to the drags. A 9 year old girl, 8 & 4 year old boys are now excited about racing and dads engine.
We also picked up a cage for the two new rabbits for my kids. They have been begging.
And my wife got a new pair of shoes. I guess we all had a great day.
Side note: my heads are cast iron center or perimeter bolt valve cover option, angled plugs, 2.02/1.60 valves, 3/8 screw in ARP rocker studs, comp cams pushrod guide plates. This is all I know for sure. The heads have EQ between the springs and say RH350Z on the ends. I can't find any info on these. EQ doesn't list an RH350Z and I was told they were RHS but EQ used to make them for RHS or something like that. My machinist said that and also they were 64cc chambers but I haven't fluid checked them yet.
Does anyone know about these heads?
Can I check intake runner volume by pouring them full like checking combustion chamber? If so how?
I need to figure out how to get smaller pics on my IPhone because I can't get any of them to load unless I email them first to myself and change the size then.
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Get the Tapatalk app the up loads are huge.(http://img.tapatalk.com/d/13/09/08/udu4ysa8.jpg)
What's under the hood??? If you have to ask maybe we shouldn't race...
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(http://img.tapatalk.com/d/13/09/08/abu6aqe3.jpg)(http://img.tapatalk.com/d/13/09/08/5esu4uhe.jpg)(http://img.tapatalk.com/d/13/09/08/ete5yne4.jpg)(http://img.tapatalk.com/d/13/09/08/atady8u3.jpg)(http://img.tapatalk.com/d/13/09/08/ahuqatu3.jpg)(http://img.tapatalk.com/d/13/09/08/5aty3unu.jpg)
This works great. Thanks
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Yup no prob :-)
What's under the hood??? If you have to ask maybe we shouldn't race...
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My heads are cast iron center or perimeter bolt valve cover option, angled plugs, 2.02/1.60 valves, 3/8 screw in ARP rocker studs, comp cams pushrod guide plates. This is all I know for sure. The heads have EQ between the springs and say RH350Z on the ends. I can't find any info on these. EQ doesn't list an RH350Z and I was told they were RHS but EQ used to make them for RHS or something like that. My machinist said that and also they were 64cc chambers but I haven't fluid checked them yet.
Does anyone know about these heads?
Can I check intake runner volume by pouring them full like checking combustion chamber? If so how?
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I've also been keeping an eye on Lunati's Closeout list. Here are a couple
20080130 $70.40, normally $300
Hydraulic Roller Cam. Fair idle, great low to mid range power for daily usage. Works well with tune port injection.
•Advertised Duration (Intake/Exhaust): 276/286
•Duration @.050" (Intake/Exhaust): 218/228
•Gross Valve Lift (Intake/Exhaust): .503"/.503"
•Lobe Seperation: 112
•Intake Center Line: 108
•RPM Range: 1800-5800
•Cam only included.
And this one, I like it. What do you think?
10120208 - $31.24 normally $143
Hydraulic Flat Tappet. Excellent street cam with 3.40+ gearing and stock stall converter. Good idle.
Advertised Duration (Int/Exh): 268/268
Duration @ .050 (Int/Exh): 218/218
Gross Valve Lift (Int/Exh): .457/.457
LSA/ICL: 110/106
Valve Lash (Int/Exh): Hyd/Hyd
RPM Range: 1500-5500 Includes: Cam Only
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I'm not interested in the first one, I thought some of you one here would like it for the price.
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Rich, the last one about the close out cam was directed at you. Compared to the other cams you ran up what does this one do. For $30 I might just get it because of price and it is in my power range choice.
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Bear in mind that the cam IS the engine. The rest of the parts exist to service the cam's needs. The cam has more influence on how the engine operates than anything else -- cam choice is EVERYTHING. Given that, I wouldn't let price steer me to a specific cam over another that was a better choice.
Here's a nice article about cam selection: http://www.crankshaftcoalition.com/wiki/How_to_choose_a_camshaft
I can't find the full cam card on the 10120208 cam on the net, so I don't have the full timing map. It seems like a lot of duration to me for what you want. I would think something like 252/260 or 254/262 would be better. The old grind 252/260 cams with a 110 LSA were very popular for street use, and a modern grind cam flows a lot better than an older grind 252/260 because the valves open and close so much faster. (Subtract .050 duration from advertised duration; 75* is old grind, 45*-50* is modern grind.)
The 12-235-2 Comp cam that Sean Murphy recommended to me for my 350 in a K10 is a modern grind 254/262 with a 111 LSA; the cam I ultimately chose is only a 240/248 with a 108 LSA, but again with the modern grind. I also have only .390/.390 lift to hold down valvetrain wear, where the 12-235-2 has .447/.462 lift. Pretty similar all in all to the Lunati except for the duration, where mine is much more focused on bottom end torque than either of the other two.
That Lunati cam looks a lot like the Comp XE268H, number 12-242-2. For grins I ran that XE268H cam on the same parameters I ran the other two: http://users.rcn.com/weyand/smalls/12-242-2nlauffer.jpg. Note that torque PEAK is the same, but 500 rpm higher than the 12-235-2. Looking at the torque converter recommendations will tell you a lot. Print them both out and then lay the pages one over the other and hold up to the light. Look at the torque curves from 1500-3500 rpm.
Overall, I think that the Lunati cam is too much duration (which means higher overlap, lower torque at a given rpm, less gas mileage, less static compression, and more horsepower higher up in the rpm range) for what you want. The 12-235-2 is under $110 at Carid and Northern Auto.
I would be interested in other people's opinions on this on the forum here. I googled that Lunati cam number and can't find any discussion of it anywhere on the net. I would not buy any cam without being able to find some discussion of it somewhere and see who's happy or sad with it and what kind of vehicle they put it in.
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I'm back to my post. I'll try to stay here. The more I read and lookup cams I am starting to pick up some more. Makes more sense. I have been having trouble with Comps website. It keeps giving me an error and I can't open the Camquest. I'll keep trying.
I did like some of the comp xtreme energy cams though. I like there options more than lunati I think. More of them at least. The xe262 which I think is the 12-235-2. Is the one I might end up with but I have said that before and still haven't ordered one yet.
I am waiting on a call back from EQ. I found out my heads are an obsolete number from 2005. Eric is hopefully gonna call with specs. I'm also debating taking them to a head magician in Stafford to flow and cc them. They are used so who knows what they are now.
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Rich I think with those eq heads and a small cam he would not use the full potential of HP and tq those heads and the right split pattern cam would produce... Just my 2 cents
What's under the hood??? If you have to ask maybe we shouldn't race...
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Another thing I was thinking about is what happens when you go to 1.6 rocker arms? It increases lift, but does it leave duration alone?
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No they will increase duration as well
What's under the hood??? If you have to ask maybe we shouldn't race...
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Rich I think with those eq heads and a small cam he would not use the full potential of HP and tq those heads and the right split pattern cam would produce... Just my 2 cents
Depends on what he wants. I ran the dyno curves using a 9.5:1 compression, which is about what he ought to get with 64cc heads.
Here's both curves. What looks better to you for use in a truck for street use?
http://users.rcn.com/weyand/smalls/12-242-2nlauffer.jpg
http://users.rcn.com/weyand/smalls/12-235-2nlauffer.jpg
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Does the dyno have a seeing specifically for those head. I've ran that dyno b4... port velocity plays a factor along with the valve size as well.
What's under the hood??? If you have to ask maybe we shouldn't race...
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I am having trouble finding out what cc the pistons are. The machinist says they are just stock dish and he can't remember exactly what that is. I have looked and looked. The closest I have found is a set of Speed Pro (which I don't think these are) that is 10cc.
Can anyone tell me just by looking at the pic above. I am figuring 12cc.
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I have used about every number combination that people say "should be" stock. I come up with a final CR of 9.14 to 9.44, except if it is the worst of the choices at 18cc dished pistons and a 67cc head putting it at 8.9. None of these numbers sound bad at all to me, they are definitely better than what I have. Until I find out more about the heads I am just guessing.
Still haven't decided to pull the trigger on a camshaft yet.
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I spent some time on the phone with Eric from EQ today. It took him quite awhile to decide my heads were a 2005 model which they did not list as a possibility. He did not show the part # RH350Z. The "Z" was the kicker. Turns out after much searching that the only combination not listed in the catalog and the most likely answer is they are the 64cc, heart shaped chamber with 180cc intake runner. I was hoping for this.
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A 180 runner is perfect for the street! Awesome head! Go Get you a tq cam somewhere in the 220 or close to range. Those 1.6 rockers will increase duration a tiny but to possibly give you a pinch of a lope.
What's under the hood??? If you have to ask maybe we shouldn't race...
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That's close to the Vortec heads, which have 64cc combustion chambers and 170cc intake runners. With flat-top pistons, you should get a static compression ratio of about 10:1. With stock dished pistons, it will be around 9:1.
What kind of pistons do you have?
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There is a picture of them in a previous post. They are dished at possibly 12cc but the machinist couldn't remember for sure.
I finally got Camquest 6 downloaded. I like it. I will be using the XE262H. Part number 12-238-2.
Probably stick with 1.5 roller tip rockers.
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Dished at 12 cc should give you about a 9:1 compression ratio, which is fine. No problem with pump gas, though you may need premium.
Looks like about 350 hp @5000 and 420 ftlb @4000. Not shabby at all.
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Here are the flow results for the heads.
Intake Lift CFM Exhaust Lift CFM
0.1 65.4 0.1 55.3
0.2 130 0.2 106.6
0.3 177.9 0.3 133.2
0.4 212.8 0.4 156.6
0.5 234.9 0.5 174.5
0.6 242.3 0.6 182.8
0.7 244.3 0.7 188.3
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Well it took some time, but Comp finally got back to me and let me know the best cam choice is the 12-238-2.
I take it as a good sign this is the same on I want so ill go ahead and purchase the full kit
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Gonna be awesome.
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Get that cam! :-) it will have a good lope to it...will sound and perform great with your setup.
What's under the hood??? If you have to ask maybe we shouldn't race...
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Hey I have RHS heads and I love them. I went with a vortec manifold and perimeter boltvalve covers. RHS only makes aluminum heads now but the heads we have are awesome for the price and flow better than vortecs. My compression ratio is a little higher and i went with a Comp 280h camshaft.
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I'm still trying to decide whether to use center bolt or perimeter bolt valve covers. I like the black Proform center bolt ones.
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I think center-bolt ones are easier to seal up.
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X2 center bolt will seal better and wool have less chance of future leak.
What's under the hood??? If you have to ask maybe we shouldn't race...
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Apologies, I also have center bolt valve covers and a Vortec intake. Currently I have factory GM vortec valve covers bu t i do have the proform ones new in the box. I had read that the centerbolt was the correct primary valve cover for these heads.
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This is the valve cover I was thinking about. Also, the timing chain cover, and air cleaner to match.
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Nice!
What's under the hood??? If you have to ask maybe we shouldn't race...
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I just placed my order for Comp's K12-238-2
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I walked across the street to the Napa to get head gaskets and oil pan set, but they did not have the ones I thought I wanted.
I was thinking about the 1003 or 1010 FelPro head gasket. What does everyone else think.
I also want the one piece oil pan gasket. Which one is it?
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Fel Pro - OS34510T This is the one. anyone have issues with the dual dipstick hole on these gaskets?
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Haven't posted in a while so I better update some.
I received my Comp Cam K kit. I switched out the springs, retainers, and locks on my heads. It already had new seals. I got my oil pump on. I picked up a new oil pan and timing cover and oil pan gasket set. I just need to get the pump pickup attached. I hope to install cam and timing set in a couple days. I am still looking for a dual plane intake close by but I'll probably end up ordering one.
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Cam is in and timing set is on. Although not bolted down as I couldn't find my cam gear bolts. I got some new ones just a bit ago.
I have "cast iron" engine paint, "aluminum" engine paint, and "black" engine paint. I can't decide I keep changing my mind on the color. The only thing I am certain of is the black valve covers and air cleaner from Procomp. Let me know your ideas. I'm leaning towards black.
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I've got an opportunity to buy a stock GM aluminum intake manifold. Does anyone know if these are worth it?
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Is it a dual plane manifold? There will be a divider fore and after through the center of the carb/TBI mounting location if it is. The dual-plane GM ones are OK.
Been thinking about engine color. With the black valve covers, I would go with something contrasting, like Chevy orange, body color, or aluminum.
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I was thinking About aluminum color and started to paint it but it just didn't look right. Maybe cause I didn't do the whole thing. I like the contrasting colors most. The black was kind of giving up on deciding. I like the orange but I want something a little different.
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You could do a hammertone finish. My bro does it on machine tools and it is awesome looking. Tough as nails, too.
I'll ask him what brand he uses.
One important note: the finish has a little bit of a grain or direction to it from brush strokes, so you have to brush it all in one direction. He gets around that by stippling it with an acid brush.
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I thought I saw a small block build on PowerBlock's Horsepower, where they used aluminum paint on the bulk of the engine. I like the way it looked, but I can't find the episode and can't remember for sure what it ended up looking like.
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I don't see it either. Normally for manifolds and water pumps and stuff they use "Dupli-Color Paint, Engine Enamel with Ceramic Resin, Gloss, Aluminum, 12 oz., Aerosol."
Here's a picture of an aluminum painted block from a forum. It's in a Vette:
(http://img30.imageshack.us/img30/4025/enginef.jpg)
Here's what a Hammerite finish looks like. Hammerite is the brand my bro uses. You must either spray it on or stipple it on with a cut-short brush, or it will show brush marks. This is "graphite" color:
(http://forum.difflock.com/userpix/392_IMG_3467_6.jpg)
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Quick update and a couple questions.
I have the heads torqued down and oil pan and timing cover on.
I was looking over my block and was wondering why there are so many threaded holes in the block. Does anyone have a diagram or something of what all the holes were used for? I know which ones are for motor mounts and fuel pump and front accessories, also the ones scored oil pressure. But, there is another one near the oil filter location and a couple on each side of block about mid way.
What do I need to look for in regards to whether or not my distributor could use rebuilding?
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The SBC has fittings for the oil dipstick on both sides. Could that be the ones midway along each side?
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Haven't updated this for awhile. Not much progress on the engine. Rockers are set, crank pulley bolted on. Painted a bunch of engine brackets after having a high school kid sandblast them in his shop class.
Still haven't received my carb back from SMI. Don't know if I said yet or not, but mine broke in shipping out to them. Broke the carb body at the fuel inlet. Dumb me, I didn't buy the extra insurance. So, I asked them to just build me one of their cores. Another $150 or so I think. I'm not ready to bolt it on, so I guess not a big deal.
I have been thinking about the serp belt setup more. For ease of installation, I have been making my stock stuff nice, in case I just put it back stock. However, I still want to do the serp setup. I purchased brackets for a 98 serpentine, but I think it could be easier if I drop back to the late 80's early 90's setup. These should take the same AC compressor, power steering pump, and alternator. Just with serpentine pulleys. Also, still the reverse water pump.
Here are some questions regarding serpentine belts.
Can I use my SI alternator and put a serp pulley on it? I know I can put the pulley on, but will it line up?
How do I change my AC compressor over to the serp pulley?
Can I use my 83 power steering pump with a serpentine pulley?
I ask, because I have a brand new AC compressor and power steering pump. My alternator is also only a year old or so. I have been searching and just haven't been able to find the answer to these questions, unless I just missed them. I'm not the greatest at searches sometimes.
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Here are some pics of power steering pumps.
1. 1983 GMC C1500 5.7L power steering pump. Part #207920 This is the one I bought.
2. 1987 GMC R1500 5.7L pump Part #207922
3. 1989 GMC C1500 5.7L pump Part #207832
4. 1991 GMC C1500 5.7L pump Part #207828
These are from RockAuto. It is easier for me to search there. The only one that listed a serpentine pulley is the 91. The 89 didn't list one at all. The 87 listed a v-belt pulley and of course the 83.