Post by: CA Big Red on January 12, 2015, 12:09:08 am
So, I'm looking for good info on how I can piece my system back together. Any good threads on this being done?
My compressor was taken out in 1995, leaving everything else. However, I know there issues with the system being "open" and contamination issues. So, are there ways to test the system?
I'd appreciate any direction or ideas on next steps to ensure success. I've got time now, but summer will be here before I know it.
Thanks in advance.
Post by: LTZ C20 on January 12, 2015, 01:36:09 am
Flush the condenser, lots of brake clean and compressed air works good. Flush all the lines the same way. Probably best to get a new accumulator, unless the one you plan on using you know for sure is good. Flush the evaporater the same way also. Then start putting it all together, new seals and O - rings at every location needed, new service ports also, now would be a good time to convert it to R134 if that hasnt been done yet. Use a battery to give power and ground to the compressor and see that the clutch engages and disengaged properly.
Once you have it all clean, connected and ready to go, do this yourself if you can or take it to a shop and have them vacuum down the system to ensure it holds vacuum. If it does, charge it up with the proper amount of PAG oil and refrigerant and test it out.
Post by: roundhouse on January 12, 2015, 07:44:36 am
I've seen several people use condensor from a 90s Yukon or Burb
The 134 needs a larger condensor to shed the heat
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Post by: CA Big Red on January 12, 2015, 08:58:17 am
I guess I have the choice between 134 and R12. I've been told 12 blows colder, is that true?
Roundhouse, I assume they have a fabrication for the brackets needed to mount the 90's style condensor?
Post by: LTZ C20 on January 12, 2015, 09:53:24 am
You can use are 12 if you can find it, but it's been outlawed so good luck, 134 is what we got now. I wouldn't worry too much about the condenser size, I have my stock condenser and 134 and the system blows very cold.
If you have a 90 ' s compressor, you will need a serpentine bracket system for the whole front of the engine, for power steering and crank shaft, basically it would be easier to just get the right compressor for your year. I did a serpentine swap on my engine, but with the brackets and powder coating them I wanted, new alternator and power steering and all the pulleys and belt and all other needed parts I have almost 1,000 dollars into just that swap. I also had to get custom hoses fitted and made to adapt the 90s style compressor lines to the older style truck lines.
Post by: roundhouse on January 12, 2015, 02:15:39 pm
If its open go back with 134
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Post by: CA Big Red on January 12, 2015, 03:13:35 pm
Post by: Jason S on January 12, 2015, 04:13:44 pm
I picked up a compressor and all the hoses of a donor rig that was working prior to being parted out.
Compressor- What compressor did you get? If it's the long A-6, they are generally good compressors - but rob some power. Whatever it is- just make sure to try to check it out as best you can. Apply power to the compressor clutch to make sure it engages. Turn the compressor by hand and listen for any abnormal sounds and 'feel' for internal, mechanical issues. Drain out the oil into a container- look for particles, metal flakes, etc. Refill compressor with appropriate amount of new, clean oil correct for the chosen refrigerant. Replace O-rings at back of compressor with new, oiled O-rings.
Hoses- If they're used hoses, check over the hoses thoroughly and look for any deformities or other issues in the rubber (or plastic) hose and the metal fittings. Looking them over, if you feel they may have a compromise, then replace them. I've lost over $100 of R-12 from a bad $10 hose... Replace O-rings at all fittings with new, oiled O-rings.
Evaporator-As long as the inlet and outlet lines haven't been kinked over, as I've often seen on an open system, then you can probably just clean/flush it out. If it's been open for 20 years, make sure it's thoroughly flushed out- small critters and insects can often times make their home in the strangest locations. If you can remove the evaporator from the truck, then you could clean out the plenum box and the evaporator fins as well as making it a little easier to flush out.
Condenser- for R-134A, if you go with a little larger condenser it would help- however, you may run into adapting fittings and making brackets. On both of my trucks they have 134A; I've run the factory style condensers and they work well too. Only issue that I've had is during one scorching summer with 115 to 120 degree temperatures...
Orifice tube- Replace
Accumulator (drier)- Replace. The desiccant inside removes any moisture from within the system. The desiccant can be saturated, also the desiccant or the sock that holds it can deteriorate.
Oil- use the oil appropriate for the refrigerant. PAG or Ester oil are two commonly used oils for R-134.
When I rebuilt the A/C system in my '74, some of the parts were used (e.g., condenser). I took the used parts to an A/C shop to have them flush it- I don't recall the price, but I don't think it was too much since I was a poor college student. I figured they'd have the right solvents and equipment to do a thorough cleaning. I tried to make sure everything was as clean as possible before assembly. It's been good for over 15 years now.
On my '73, back in 2004, I replaced an aftermarket A/C system that I had installed with a factory A/C system. The condenser, evaporator and hoses were new. The compressor was rebuilt. Again, I tried to ensure everything was completely clean and it's been good now for over 10 years.
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So, I'm looking for good info on how I can piece my system back together. Any good threads on this being done?I'm not aware of any threads. If you're using factory parts then you should be able to follow the Factory Shop Manual for your model year truck. There should be a pdf of the factory manual in the tech section on this site. Also, I (or others) can post some photos of a factory setup if there is something specific.
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I know there issues with the system being "open" and contamination issues. So, are there ways to test the system?Once everything is cleaned up and flushed out, and the parts are all connected (i.e., A/C system is assembled), then you can attach a vacuum pump and gauges to the system (Autozone rents them) and evacuate all the air. It'll take around an hour for the system to be evacuated. After the system is evacuated, shut gauge valves, leave the gauges connected and turn off pump. Then after at least an hour, check the gauges to see if any vacuum has been lost. If so, then there is a leak somewhere- often times it's a fitting but it could be a compressor seal, evaporator or condenser.
If you're satisfied that the system is evacuated and holding vacuum, then charge with your choice of refrigerant.
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I guess I have the choice between 134 and R12. I've been told 12 blows colder, is that true?In my opinion, R-12 works better in the 70's and 80's trucks than R-134a; however, R-134a still works well. Considering the current availability and the price difference of R-12 vs. R-134a (unless you score some R-12 cans cheap), it's usual to just switch to R-134a. Watching for sales at autoparts stores and some of the farm supply stores, I've picked up R-134 for anywhere from $6-$8 per can.
Post by: LTZ C20 on January 12, 2015, 04:24:32 pm
Well done Jason.
Post by: 78BIG-TEN on January 12, 2015, 08:43:32 pm
Post by: CA Big Red on January 13, 2015, 02:20:44 am
I'll keep you posted and let you know when I'm done.
Post by: Jason S on January 13, 2015, 08:45:56 am
Jason S, if there wasn't a good thread on this before, I think you nailed it. This should get a novice like me through.
I'll keep you posted and let you know when I'm done.
Well, I sure hope it helps. Take lots of photos!
Post by: LTZ C20 on January 13, 2015, 09:39:39 am
Post by: CA Big Red on October 25, 2015, 10:02:11 pm
So, I hate to disappoint, but I am going the other direction and will post pics along the way a, but will start a new thread for that.
The project summits underway, but I've been waylaid by the amount of rust I found in the floors.
Post by: CA Big Red on February 07, 2016, 10:53:56 am
Post by: CA Big Red on February 07, 2016, 10:54:30 am
Post by: roundhouse on February 07, 2016, 11:01:35 am
I could not get the seatbelt bolts outtheyre glued in
Gotta use a impact gun usually
Sometimes you gotta use a ratchet with a cheater pipe on it to break em loose
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Post by: CA Big Red on February 07, 2016, 11:03:34 am
Post by: CA Big Red on February 07, 2016, 11:11:22 am
Post by: roundhouse on February 13, 2016, 06:50:53 pm
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Post by: CA Big Red on March 29, 2016, 10:01:03 pm
Post by: CA Big Red on March 29, 2016, 10:19:30 pm
Post by: CA Big Red on March 29, 2016, 10:21:08 pm
Post by: CA Big Red on March 29, 2016, 10:21:54 pm
Post by: CA Big Red on March 29, 2016, 10:22:46 pm
Post by: CA Big Red on March 29, 2016, 10:23:20 pm
Post by: VileZambonie on March 30, 2016, 02:04:40 pm
What do you do when you strip out the star bolt
You weld a nut to the bolt and remove it while it's hot
Post by: CA Big Red on March 30, 2016, 02:12:11 pm
Post by: hatzie on March 30, 2016, 05:06:32 pm
So, I bit the bullet. Purchased a VintageAir system. This after I collected everything I needed for the stock system install. I decided to go Vintage for the guarantee, the technology and a buddy of mine who just put one in and swore by it.
So, I hate to disappoint, but I am going the other direction and will post pics along the way a, but will start a new thread for that.
The project summits underway, but I've been waylaid by the amount of rust I found in the floors.
No disappointment. That system will get rid of the big ugly lump on the firewall and is engineered from the ground up for R134a right from the get go. No headaches. If you can afford it it's the way to go.
BTW the interior looks real clean. Nice work.
Post by: VileZambonie on March 30, 2016, 06:21:12 pm
Post by: hatzie on March 30, 2016, 09:19:41 pm
They really should have designed V-A to work with the factory controls though.Replacing the HVAC box with a more compact electronic unit why not replace the cable controls?
I thought they looked similar to the factory controls. Are they really cheesy?
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Post by: VileZambonie on March 31, 2016, 09:21:28 pm
Post by: hatzie on April 01, 2016, 04:05:58 pm
I think the controls look horrible if you want that factory look in the dash. This was was why I did not purchase a VA unit altogether and ended up going a different route.I've never seen them up close and personal.
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Post by: VileZambonie on April 01, 2016, 05:10:29 pm
http://www.vintageair.com/2012catalog/2012%20VintageAir%20Catalog%20Final%20WEB%20(Page%2036).pdf
Post by: CA Big Red on April 03, 2016, 05:36:50 pm
Post by: CA Big Red on April 03, 2016, 05:37:59 pm
Post by: hatzie on April 03, 2016, 06:47:02 pm
Hatzie, the cable controls are replaced with the V/A unit
I realized that. I believe they use servo motors like most newer OEM systems.
They could and should make them look similar to the factory unit. It could be done with a small effort... just put Vintage Air in script on the Lexan face.
Post by: CA Big Red on December 04, 2016, 10:14:26 am
I'm down to one last wire in my Vintage Air install. Everything is ready to go, but one wire and getting it charged with refrigerant.
I haven't wired anything to the ignition switch before, so I am not clear on how this purple wire is supposed to tap into the ignition switch like they have in the wiring diagram.
I can see the ignition switch on the back of the column, but that is as far as I've gotten and when I research this to find improved instruction, photos or videos, I don't see anything.
Where do I actually connect the purple wire to?
Post by: bd on December 04, 2016, 03:15:58 pm
Look at the factory fuse box. Along the middle of one edge are two power tap cavities marked "ACC FUSED." Both power taps are protected by the 15-amp "RADIO - IDLE STOP" fuse. Connect to either terminal. This will power the circuit in all "Key ON" positions except crank. It prevents extraneous load on the battery while cranking the engine.
Post by: CA Big Red on December 04, 2016, 03:19:41 pm
Post by: CA Big Red on December 04, 2016, 03:20:08 pm
Post by: hatzie on December 04, 2016, 10:52:53 pm
Don't connect to an ignition source. Instead connect to accessory.You could use the heater power wire. Heat and AC are a sub harness. With an ignition switched power wire.
Look at the factory fuse box. Along the middle of one edge are two power tap cavities marked "ACC FUSED." Both power taps are protected by the 15-amp "RADIO - IDLE STOP" fuse. Connect to either terminal. This will power the circuit in all "Key ON" positions except crank. It prevents extraneous load on the battery while cranking the engine.
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Post by: 1967KaiserM715 on December 05, 2016, 04:51:30 pm
Now I'm putting a new floor mat down on Sunday.Do you have any pics of this installed? And is it the full vinyl floor? Sorry to side track a little.
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Post by: 76Texan on December 05, 2016, 07:02:20 pm
Mine was nasty and dusty so now I am pulling everything from that side. Thought it best to just spray it with a heat protecting type spray.
Post by: CA Big Red on December 06, 2016, 11:30:00 pm
Now I'm putting a new floor mat down on Sunday.Do you have any pics of this installed? And is it the full vinyl floor? Sorry to side track a little.
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I do! Here are a couple before and afters:
The new floor pans
(http://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20161207/88b0f1af84a08caa2098b2b3dcb37376.jpg)
The lizard skin
(http://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20161207/46943042ff9a2f04af58f93209c60d43.jpg)
Laying out the vinyl attempt
(http://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20161207/46c68dafd864d1342a9dbe77fdd164aa.jpg)
Installed
(http://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20161207/71a7a26fae246aa57d50d9a72e777c9f.jpg)
(http://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20161207/fb206216b1286e922b04cb1de2dd9f36.jpg)
I have all of the trim, but I'm going to install a nice stereo, run speaker wire, etc before I finish all that.
Post by: CA Big Red on December 06, 2016, 11:32:47 pm
The liner material you sprayed on behind the dash. Did you put the old heat protective pad material behind the dash as well?
Mine was nasty and dusty so now I am pulling everything from that side. Thought it best to just spray it with a heat protecting type spray.
I haven't put it back in for the same reasons. I don't know that I will, but I haven't considered anything more than the lizard skin that I laid down already.
Post by: CA Big Red on December 11, 2016, 09:54:52 am
(http://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20161211/fa5d659e47331d7cec7a9393b25b865e.jpg)
But getting the compressor bracket to work was tricky. My old AC bracket and power steering brackets just weren't going to work, so I picked up a new pump and power steering bracket.
(http://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20161211/235116ad06f32f353f69e08c51695260.jpg)
Now I can tighten the pump belt and get my new compressor bracket to sit right.
Next, I just need to go get the system charged, belt and this thing better blow cold.
(http://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20161211/c34590f4606153103b604dc1ca098e38.jpg)
(http://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20161211/2fe58be137d1a1ec7118f2e419858f18.jpg)
Post by: roundhouse on August 04, 2017, 06:49:25 am
Working on repairing the floor in ours and then installing vintage air
Found the previous owner did a horrible job of swapping the Trans tunnel
Couldn't figure it why it was always so hot in the cab
Guess that one inch gap between the Trans tunnel and the firewall was a problem
Every project has been like that , so we named this truck "snowball "
Some kind of rubber bedliner stuff on the floor that won't grind or sand off
Gotta get rid of that and weld up the floor holes
Then dynamat everything , new firewall insulation , and new insulation and carpet on the floor
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20170804/4aa0485365c239ff19b879109200f1a6.jpg)(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20170804/8eeed641e4465060b83e7145477a083b.jpg)(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20170804/d02f1676da23fb5e7f4be925e75304aa.jpg)
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Post by: CA Big Red on February 24, 2018, 08:12:56 pm
Following this thread
Working on repairing the floor in ours and then installing vintage air
Found the previous owner did a horrible job of swapping the Trans tunnel
Couldn't figure it why it was always so hot in the cab
Guess that one inch gap between the Trans tunnel and the firewall was a problem
Every project has been like that , so we named this truck "snowball "
Some kind of rubber bedliner stuff on the floor that won't grind or sand off
Gotta get rid of that and weld up the floor holes
Then dynamat everything , new firewall insulation , and new insulation and carpet on the floor
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20170804/4aa0485365c239ff19b879109200f1a6.jpg)(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20170804/8eeed641e4465060b83e7145477a083b.jpg)(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20170804/d02f1676da23fb5e7f4be925e75304aa.jpg)
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How did it turn out? I ended up just finishing my entire interior. Decided to throw in carpet too because I received a kit that I didn’t order from a company I shall not mention. They said, “just keep it.” So, after a year of just the Vinyl, I added the carpet. It does ride quieter with the carpet. So, that was a bonus.
I’d be curious how yours turned out.
Post by: CA Big Red on February 24, 2018, 08:24:10 pm
I definitely think the carpet helped with sound and temp. Helps the vintage air system warm and cool the rig down faster. With the installation of the retro stereo, I was able to button up the dash too.
Turned out pretty nice. Just a few more things and the interior is complete.
Post by: CA Big Red on February 24, 2018, 08:25:35 pm
Post by: VileZambonie on February 24, 2018, 09:54:12 pm