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73-87 Chevy _ GMC Trucks => Brakes, Frame, Steering & Suspension => The Lows (Lowering/Drops) => Topic started by: gwcrim on January 14, 2017, 09:52:29 am

Title: spindles or springs
Post by: gwcrim on January 14, 2017, 09:52:29 am
I know this topic has been covered ad nauseum but I like a good conversation.... as it may be.

I want to lower my '80 C10 about 2-3 in the front and 3-4 in the rear.  The rear has brand new leaf springs and I'll use shackles and hangers there.  The front springs are original with 60k on them.  Wheels are 15" slotted aluminum with 4.5" back space.  The truck is not to be used as a daily driver but I don't want to sacrifice ride or handling.  Especially handling.  I'd rather do this right the first time than try and save a buck and have to do it again.

My options as I see them are:

1- cut the original springs
2- new lowering springs
3- lowering spindles

Pros and cons?
Title: Re: spindles or springs
Post by: zieg85 on January 14, 2017, 10:27:25 am
Well my $.02  I have not personally lowered a vehicle however 1) cut stock springs will ride very rough.  2) lowering springs alone may make getting the alignment right 3) best way to go if your current rims will clear, alignment should be best doing #3 since your only wanting 2-3 inches.
Title: Re: spindles or springs
Post by: gwcrim on January 14, 2017, 12:00:01 pm
Truck needs an alignment so that's not a factor.  Wheel clearance is.

Is that a vote for springs then?
Title: Re: spindles or springs
Post by: VileZambonie on January 14, 2017, 12:20:48 pm
The right way to do it is with lowering spindles. Cutting a coil to index will be okay too but once you go beyond that you are not going to be happy with the ride. You made need a 1/4" wheel spacer as well with those wheels.
Title: Re: spindles or springs
Post by: SkinnyG on January 14, 2017, 12:24:37 pm
On my previous truck (not a square), I ran low via springs only, and then later switched to spindles.

The difference was noticeable - the truck was "better" with spindles.  It felt like something was unusual with spring only, but you couldn't quite put your finger on it.  The spindles felt a lot better.

However, the spindles were not a $250 smile on my face.  They were better, but not $250 better.

Do note:

Cutting springs or using drop springs will alter where the wheel is in the camber curve, and change the roll center dramatically.  You will likely get more scrub (lateral movement of the tire in bump) which will wear out the front tires quicker.  You may also move the steering arms such that bump steer is made worse.  In this case, spindles would be better.  If you cut springs or use drop springs, you may need shorter shocks and/or shorter bumpstops in order to ride fine.  Drop springs should be stiffer to account for the reduced travel, but in my experience they are not usually stiff enough.

Also:

Spindles often move the tie rod end further inboard to clear the now higher wheel, which will reduce Ackerman, increasing turning radius and extra tire scrub on turns.

Reality:

You will likely want to go lower in the future (that's how this starts - "just a little bit more..."), and you will eventually need spindles to do that.
Title: Re: spindles or springs
Post by: 82silverado on January 14, 2017, 12:29:11 pm
I lowered mine 2 inches all the way around. In the front I heated the springs. I have no alignment or ride issues at all and stock shocks still work just fine. Truck rides like a car.
Title: Re: spindles or springs
Post by: gwcrim on January 14, 2017, 02:56:28 pm
So Skinny, seems as though you're saying that spindles are the better way to go.... except when they arent'?   ;)
Title: Re: spindles or springs
Post by: SkinnyG on January 14, 2017, 03:31:07 pm
Hahahaha.   Magic always comes with a price, dearie.

They have their advantages, they have their disadvantages.  The best you can do is be informed, and make the choice that makes sense to you.

My '77 has 3" spindles AND cut springs.

I will ~never~ use dropped control arms.

(If I were to do it again, I would probably Z the frame and pancake the crossmember instead.....)
Title: Re: spindles or springs
Post by: Captkaos on January 17, 2017, 02:23:14 pm
I have used all methods.  After 2 coils your ride is going to be bad.
Of the otiond you list, spindles and springs

Chris Lucas
73-87chevytrucks.com
squarebody.biz

Title: Re: spindles or springs
Post by: gwcrim on January 19, 2017, 04:53:08 pm
Anyone have any experience with Chassis Tech?

http://www.ebay.com/itm/282067500632?_trksid=p2060353.m1438.l2649&ssPageName=STRK%3AMEBIDX%3AIT
Title: Re: spindles or springs
Post by: Captkaos on January 19, 2017, 10:38:50 pm
I have used them on a couple trucks but sold the trucks so no long term experience.  I typically stick with Belltech, western, etc.
Title: Re: spindles or springs
Post by: gwcrim on January 20, 2017, 12:19:10 pm
I wound up getting spindles, shackles, and hangers from McGaugheys. 
Title: Re: spindles or springs
Post by: Captkaos on January 20, 2017, 06:18:37 pm
What rim size?  15's and McGaughys don't like each other much.
Title: Re: spindles or springs
Post by: 82silverado on January 20, 2017, 06:24:35 pm
Stuff like that is exactly why I went with heating the springs on the front when I decided to lower only a couple inches in the front. Cost was zero.
Title: Re: spindles or springs
Post by: Captkaos on January 20, 2017, 06:35:14 pm
Heating springs are a bad idea, it fatigues the spring and it will eventually collapse.  If you are doing it on the cheap and want about 2" drop just lop off 1 coil set it back in and drive it around the block and measure than go in small increments replace drive and measure.
Title: Re: spindles or springs
Post by: Jerr-conn on January 20, 2017, 06:41:29 pm
I'm a newbie to trucks. Want to cut 1coil out of front. Have 6 leaf springs in rear. Want to remove
2 coils from rear and also install 2" rear shackles. What can I expect for ride quality? How will
Truck set. I'm 79  and just want a cruiser.    Jerry
Title: Re: spindles or springs
Post by: gwcrim on January 20, 2017, 08:37:55 pm
What rim size?  15's and McGaughys don't like each other much.

15x9 aluminum slots, 4-1/2 back space.  I was told I would have to do some 'modifications' to the lower arm.  Are there any that would work with such a rim? 
Title: Re: spindles or springs
Post by: 82silverado on January 21, 2017, 06:41:57 am
Heating springs are a bad idea, it fatigues the spring and it will eventually collapse.  If you are doing it on the cheap and want about 2" drop just lop off 1 coil set it back in and drive it around the block and measure than go in small increments replace drive and measure.

I must have got lucky. Did it 6 years ago. Had them out a month ago for control arm bushings. No defects so far. If I tear it down again I will use your advice with another set I have. Thanks.
Title: Re: spindles or springs
Post by: gwcrim on February 21, 2017, 05:14:16 pm
Well the spindles are not going to work.  Way too much interference with the tie rod mount and the rim.

So springs it must be.  The truck has about 65k miles on it and it's 37 years old.  Rear springs are new with a 4 inch drop.  As it sits, a 3" drop in the front would even out the edge of the wheel well front to rear.  However, the front has the original springs.  If they have worn to the point that they are sagging an inch from stock, then a 3" drop spring would only net me a 2" drop.

How much sag would the original coils springs have now?
Title: Re: spindles or springs
Post by: gwcrim on February 21, 2017, 10:00:47 pm
I'm going with a 3" drop spring.  Just thought I'd relieve the suspense.
Title: Re: spindles or springs
Post by: Captkaos on February 22, 2017, 09:22:09 pm
I'm a newbie to trucks. Want to cut 1coil out of front. Have 6 leaf springs in rear. Want to remove
2 coils from rear and also install 2" rear shackles. What can I expect for ride quality? How will
Truck set. I'm 79  and just want a cruiser.    Jerry
There is no coils in the back, did you mean leafs,  It should be slightly softer ride in the rear.  The front will come down about 1" or so, but it isn't just a matter of cutting the same amount off, you will need to sneak up on it to get it where it will be level.

15x9 aluminum slots, 4-1/2 back space.  I was told I would have to do some 'modifications' to the lower arm.  Are there any that would work with such a rim? 
Have to be bigger than 15's