73-87chevytrucks.com
73-87 Chevy _ GMC Trucks => Engine/Drivetrain => Topic started by: jays2w87 on September 19, 2007, 08:37:47 pm
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Has anyone out there swapped out a 4.3 (v6) TBI and put in a 5.7 Carb engine ? My new resto / mod truck is a 87 1500 long bed. I have done a few trucks (5) and this one is the 1st with out the small block already in it. So, since the truck is in Great shape and I LOVE this truck I wanna put a v8 in. I know there are many out there that would rather the TBI or TPI engine for this rig but, I'm alittle old school and I really wanna get back in touch with a carb engine. :)
Some of my issues might be..... engine mounts ?? anyone. (I have not yet popped out the 4.3 to get a good view) Or how about fuel ? I can clip my in tank pump wires and plug the supply and run fuel to the mechanical pump via the return I have now, ... right ?
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You won't be able to pull fuel through the EFI pump with a mechanical one, and I wouldn't recommend using the return line.
The 4.3L is the same as a V8 350, just 2 cylinders are missing. Everything will actually swap right over including the TBI unit, you just need an intake, different injectors and a new chip and you are ready to go... It would be MUCH easier staying with the TBI.
Personally if I were to go the Carb route I would replace the sending unit with a Carb version and run the supply to the current supply and tie into the existing fuel line.
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Some of my issues might be..... engine mounts ?? anyone. (I have not yet popped out the 4.3 to get a good view) Or how about fuel ? I can clip my in tank pump wires and plug the supply and run fuel to the mechanical pump via the return I have now, ... right ?
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I am about to do that swap. Looks to me that the frame mounts are different but I have had a chance to take it out yet.
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I know that in my past mods I have seen the kits, s-10, ranger and so on, I have not see a chevy (GM) swap kit out there. Thats not to say there is not one, I never assume.....
I have looked at the small block mounts and the 4.3 mounts . They are different. However they are only off by 1/2 inch (it looks) block plates that is. I'm hoping the frame mounts in the truck are suitable to take the small block.... You would think they did not differ that much. That would cause too much confusion on the assembly line (so you'd think)
Knowing that the tbi set up is still on the drawing board makes me feel better.
Is the fuel pressure the same for both 6 and 8cyl set ups? Or would the size injector I use determine that?
fyi (this forum is awesome !!!!!) ;D
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S10s never came with a V8, that is why there are swap kits in them. The C10's did and that is why there isn't one for them.
The frame mounts are the same, the block clamshells are not the same, you need the V8 mounts. All the accessories will bolt to the 350. You need a different radiator and a shroud, intake and 350 injectors, and the exhaust MAY have different outlets. (off the top of my head)
All TBI systems us the same pump an all use the same Throttle body, the only difference is the injector size (this excludes the 454 TB)
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Okay, Sounds good. I think tbi is the way .....
Thanks for the info !
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TBI is definitely the way to go 4 your truck. BTW You're very close to me in Enfield. If you need anything let me know.
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You're very close to me in Enfield. If you need anything let me know.
wish i was state side ;D
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Sweet ! Good to know, I think I'm gunna start cleaning out my garage. This project is going to run into the winter so thank God for heated garages !
I'm still lookin for an engine. Currently the 4.3 is shot. I though about workin on it to make it drivable till I do the swap, but I dont wanna spend money on a engine I dont want. I'll keep you posted.
Like wise on the help. I'm either at work or home (3 kids) so let me know!
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rather than putting the V6 back in, just cut a hole in the floor and do like the Flinstones!
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yah, not a huge 6 cyl fan..... If were talkin about my daily driver ya sure. Although I thought about lookin for a wrecked Buick GN . I have seen a few my some crazy power at the Track. Built and geared runnin mid 9.'s Or all that and juice gettin into low 9's high 8's
Only issue is finding a GN engine is not easy.
This time I'm doin a streetable truck. Something I can drive to work all summer, that looks good and can burn the tires whenever I feel the need. When I have a ride that hooks up nice I dont mind buyin tires once a year ......... (some times twice)
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Hey Bitzer
My buddy lives over there in Enfield. I've know him my whole life. Great guy ..... owns a 89 Suburban and a 76 step side Runs 38 inch tires. The pick up is Black and the sub is Blue.
Says Tattooed white trash on the tail gate.Really sweet rig.
He also had a Jeep Cherokee set up really nice. died though so you wont see that one around Enfield anymore.
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If I could find a good used 4.3 for my 86 I would put one back in it. They are good smooth running and get decent fuel economy. I just can't find one around the Chicagoland that is any good.
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Dont get me wrong they ARE a great engine. Again I drive one to work and back everyday! However for a custom resto / mod I think the way to go is 8 cyl. The power, look, sound. You cant beat it !
The 87 I have has 80,000 miles on it so I think I might actually rebuild this 4.3 and wrap it in plastic.
You never know........
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My 86 has a little less that 71K on it and it goes through about a quart every 200 miles. She sat for a while and I think the oil rings went bad, i bought it that way. I have to push start it because the block is cracked where the starter mounts so the block is junk. Everything else is good including the carb and all the emission stuff which I need. I know there are a lot of 4.3L out there but I need one that I can put the mechanical fuel pump on so my years are limited.
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That sounds like a tough one to find. I'm I remember correctly the 4.3 era is also the tame time fuel injection started becoming standard. Huh, how about an older chevy s10 or blazer / jimmy ? I know they are also out there in some of the cars . Montecarlo maybe ??
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The 4.3L on the G-bodys started in 1985 and were TBI. Only light trucks and Vans used the carb. For light trucks (1/2T C/K series) the carb was 1 year, 1986. The Safari/Astro had it one year extra starting in 1985. S-series didn't get the 4.3L until 1988 and it was TBI.
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Gottcha,
Bye the way your rig SU is that tied to the band suicidal? Both my son and I LOVE them !! Once it goes in the CD player its stays for months.
Chris, You have vast knowledge.... whats your take on this ??
Heres the story, I had been lookin for my next project. Money was tight and I saw this ad for my 87. I called and the guy said he was goin thru eviction with a tenant . He kept the truck there and had to wait till the court said he could return to his own property. He said he would call me once he got word from court , but I didnt think I would hear back. He said he had a ton of calls on it.
1 week later my cell rings and its him. says hes all set and has the title, original purchase papers everything. (its a 87 R10 4.3 L one owner with 80,000 mile local since new) Look at my pictures close, its in awesome condition !
The catch is he needed me to come and get it That Day ! Price .... $100.00
I couldnt line up a flat bed so I asked him what the deal was with driving it.
He said he thinks its a head gasket, it smokes. It does run though. (its 40 milesfrom my house)
So I grabbed a bottle of sealer , a bottle of prestone, 4 gallons of water and my tools and I was off.
I get there and it fires right up. Add the sealer, and a good mix of coolant and put the cap on. I was going to shut it down while we did paper work but he said dont , it wont fire up again unless you wait 20 minutes. So I left it running.
While we did the paper work it stopped smokin, the guy was like" dang, it stopped. That stuff worked"
I pulled away and it drove sweet . What a nice ride !!! I stopped for gas and hit the road. All highway to my house. so it drove okay seemed like it needed to be gone thru.... the ride on the other hand. OMG what a sweet truck !!These RL body trucks have always been a favorite. My best friend is on his 5th, he has had 4x4, 1 ton dually, suburban. all of them.
So, I'm 25 mile into my ride home (15 miles away) and I go from one route to another on a connector ramp, the speed limit is 40 I'm doin 40 . The connector is a huge curve. While I'm goin around the curve it starts to choke, its popin and dies. I roll to the side and thats it! fyi, no plates on the truck......
My kids were with my wife behind me and my son said goin around the curve it started to smoke. Prior to that no smoke.
I get out, the truck is not running, but smoke is pouring out of the exhaust. I pop the hood and its also comming out of the TB. I take the rad cap off (wicked hot) obviously it was over heating. The whole ride I kept lookin to see it there was steam coming out of the front end, didnt seem to be . But it was also 85degrees that day and I was doin 60mph so it was hard to tell. It has a temp guage but , yup.. dont work.
I grab the water (my wife was chasing me with all my crap in her car) start to pour it in and as I got the radiator about 1/2 way full it instantly began to boil the water I was adding.
I waited 10 minutes and continued to fill. put the cap on and at that point it wouldnt even turn over.
Now keep in mind. I'm smarter than all this. My only reasoning was I had to get the truck home that day ! And heck, where am I gunna find a deal like this again......
So, with no way to get it home, I lock the doors and we go home. My wife says we'll its only 100.00 we have had bigger issues, " dont worry so much"
My issue.... screw the $100.00 I want the truck !
The next morning I get a call from the car club " go wait near the truck, I'm comin with a flat bed"
So I hauled butt over to the truck, The State Police got there a little while earlier and put one of those cool Orange stickers on the tail gate, ABANDON VEHICAL
The flat bed shows up, we load it. and bring it home!
So, I have cleaned it up a little, tried to turn it over once just for the heck of it. (nothing)
I'm pretty knowledgable so, I'm thinking Its LOCKED UP. Siezed up good. My only idea it to take the starter off and turn the key. I have power, but when I turn the key nothing at all. Not even a click or any type of noise. Just outta chance see if the starter is frozen. The key goes in, I turn, I get the seat belt light and buzzer , I turn again to start and Zip, nothing.
Thats why I plan to do an engine swap. (a) it needs one. (b) I'm gunna turn this sweet 2 wheeler into a toy.
Anyhow, what are your thoughts on the 4.3 thats in it. (trash ??)
I have not played with it at all. I just got the truck 2 weeks ago and have not had a real chance to get deep into it. Let me tell you, its pretty, just dont run....... currently
What are your thoughts ??
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Go for the 350. It will get slightly less milage or maybe even the same ,but you'll enjoy it alot more. ;D
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No Doubt !
I have been on the hunt. Found a pontiac 400 for 100 bucks . needs a rebuild ..... I also found a 350 tpi says it runs, he wants 300.00 it has a mild cam in it. Doesnt look like your though. You can tell it wasnt taken care of and it looks like crap.
I was thinkin of playin with the 4.3 but, Do I really wanna waste my time when I'm going to rip it out anyhow? ...... I dont know, I think I'll just keep lookin for that small block and get this project goin.
Hows your tpi? Ride it yet?
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Ya, I took it for a drive , but its running real rough. I got to reset the timing tommorow.
Keep searching for the smallblock. Save your money to dump into that and try to resist the urge to play with the 6. You'll be glad you did.
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Roger that !
I have popped the hood 2 times in the 2 weeks I have had the truck, both times I popped it look in and closed it I bet I had the hood up for maybe 2 or 3 minutes. I Know I want the small block so anything else doesnt fill my urge to work on it.
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Okay, so I'm trying to pull parts together, dug out my engine lift and I'm searchin for a small block. I posted an ad online, says - Small block to "donate" for a budget project.
I got a reply. The guy is givin me a tbi set up (tb and intake) from a 305
My question is, can I put this set up on a 350 ? I know older engines a carb is a carb. This is one of many builds for me but the 1st tbi one. He also has the computer and wires. The truck he removed it from was an 87 . My truck is a 87 (4.3) Once I have the 5.7 done the computer and/or chip from his should work right ?
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The only real difference is the PROM in the computer for the 305- 350. The injectors are the same, harness is the same, fuel pump etc.
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Sweet! This should make things go easier !
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By the way your rig SU is that tied to the band suicidal? Both my son and I LOVE them !!
Actually no. Long story short when I was 18 I decided I was going to lower my pickup and my buddy was talking about lifting his Jeep. We were sitting at his house and his mom heard us and commented "lifting this, lowering that, you two have suicidal tendencies" It stuck from that day forward.
305 TBI injectors are not the same as 350 injectors. 305's are 49lb and 350 are 61lb
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Suicidal Tendencies is one of my favorite bands ;D
Yeah the oem injectors on 305 to 350 were slightly smaller orifice. You can run them on a mild TBI 350 though with no problem. I'm pretty sure GM superceeded both the 305 and 350 TBI injectors to the same 17112493 injectors if I remember right....
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I also noticed the frame members on the V-6 will have to be moved forward, but yes they are the same. Getting ready for my switch...
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sweet, thanks for the info.
Found my engine today, 350 4 bolt from a 84 suburban. needs a rebuild but , that was part of the plan anyhow. If all goes well I'll have it on the stand this weekend .......
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I also noticed the frame members on the V-6 will have to be moved forward, but yes they are the same.
Forward? The crossmember only has one location, the engine stands only have 2: upper and lower. It has been a while since I even looked at a V6 setup though.
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Chris
I should really look at the set up.... just havent had time since I got the truck a few weeks ago I should be able to drop my SB Chevy 350 right in though, right ? The engine came from a 84 suburban. I have never done a v6 to 8 swap on one of these trucks yet.
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Should be a piece of cake. Just got to find which motor mount holes to use. One set of holes will line up with the smallblock motor mounts.
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You need the engine mounts with the 350 and it should sit right down on top of the current frame mounts bolted to the frame stands. the frame stands have 2 marked positions. I6 (lower) and V8 (upper). 4.3L should use the V8 mounts since it is a 350 with 2 cylinders missing.
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Thats wht I thought, Just want to be sure. Ill have the 350 ready for tear down this weekend. The 4.3 will come out maybe next weekend. I'm thinking I'll have the 350 done in a month and ready to go in. Hopfully sooner but I want to think in real time .
Thanks Pugsy / Chris !
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I also noticed the frame members on the V-6 will have to be moved forward, but yes they are the same.
Forward? The crossmember only has one location, the engine stands only have 2: upper and lower. It has been a while since I even looked at a V6 setup though.
pictured are the v-6 and v-8 placements of the left side stand
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Does anyone know if the 8 will drop in, or what needs to be done?
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You just have to move it forward like the picture. You need the V-8 mount that bolts to the piece that moves forward. They actually are the same, I just got closer to the V-8 one and it looks larger.
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Unbolt the cross member and move it towards the front ? If so doe anyone know the pec? I dont wanna chenge too much and throw things off .
Thanks zieg85
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Sorry about my spelling, I think my key board is on its way out. Keeps leavin out letters and I have to go back to fix them. POS!
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V-6 uses the farthest one back and the V-8 uses the farthest up front. I will let you know when I find out for sure but I don't think it is a big deal. It will only line up 2 ways.
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okay, Thanks for the heads up. Any other info would be great !!
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V-6 uses the farthest one back and the V-8 uses the farthest up front. I will let you know when I find out for sure but I don't think it is a big deal. It will only line up 2 ways.
I took a good look at them today. The V-6 frame mount is different than the V-8. The pictures clearly show the difference. I got under the truck and they are different between the 2. You will have to get the set up from a donor V-8
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Bolt in or weld ?
Once I have my smallblock on the stand I will pull the 6 and park it next to the 8 to see. The good new is once I have the engine out theres a ton of room in there to work.
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Bolt in.
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Great !
Thanks
Hey Pugsy hows the tpi engine?
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Going slowly with the new baby. ;)