general basic paint questions

[ngarman123]

ok i am thinking of doing some painting but had some general questions
1. base/clear or a single stage. what are the pros and cons of either. (price, ease, forgiveness, overall??)
2. can single stage be buffed or wet sanded?
3. ballpark price of everything needed supplies.
thanks!!

[Blazin]

Single stage can be wet sanded and buffed.
Generally single stage acrylic enamel is a bit cheaper than base clear of the same brand, & holds up fine with correct wash, and waxing.
Single stage urethane is comparable price to a base clear urethane.

Touch up on a base clear is a bit easier because you only have to cover the damaged area with color, and clear the whole panel. In other words you have to blend the color but not the finish. Where as single stage you have to blend the color and the finish. when it comes to painting base clear remember it almost like doing two paint jobs. You have to spray three or four coats of color maybe more depending on hidding, then spray three coats of clear. Single stage is three or four coats and your done.

Things to remember single stage is more forgiving than base clear when it comes to surface prep, minor scratches or chips that you neglect to remove or didn't get filled all the way with primer are less visible.

Non metallic is much easier to work with if its your first time out painting.

Your finished product will reflect the surface prep / body work time you spend.

Nothing wrong with shopping around for less expensive products, but on the other hand the cheapest is probably not the best deal.

Stay away from lacquer primers. Stick with self etching, urethane, & epoxy based products.

I use allot of 5 star, and Transtar products, and have good luck. Some of the Martin Senior stuff is OK. They have several levels of quality. Stay with the higher stuff in Martin Senior. I also use Allot of Dupont stuff. As far as tape goes, don't settle for anything less than 3M. The dollar store / Wal Mart / hardware store crap is crap, same goes for sand paper. Use masking paper not news paper.

As far as price its all in how much work your rig needs to get it ready for paint, what quality of paint used, wether or not its base clear. You could blow $any where from $400 to $1,500 just on materials.

Do you have a compressor that can handle doing body work? Minimum 5 HP 60 Gallon two stage compressor.

[HAULIN IT]

How about answering a couple of questions. What color are we talking about & metallic/pearl or not? Is this truck garage kept or does it sit out? Do you have any spraying experience? What is your real expectations of this finish? Daily driver all one color, nice weekend cruiser, near show quality resto? With a little more input from you, I think we can give good accurate advice. Lorne

[ngarman123]

blazin thanks for all the info! i should of been alittle more detailed. the color i am thinking of shooting is blue. not a light blue but not navy either. it is similar to the viper blue that was talked about acouple of pages back in the body forum. that is very close to the current color so it wont be a drastic change. it is not going to be a full resto and truck sits outside. (to tall to fit in the garage:(
    body is in good shape some dings here and there. acouple of rust spots starting to bubble in acouple of places that i want to take care of.
    i doesnt need to be a show finish but i dont want it to look like it was done with a rattle can either. if i can get a nice gloss i will be happy. doesnt have to be perfect.
   i dont have any painting experience but am eager to learn. i am trying to be realistic with my expectations i know there will be a learning curve.
   i have a compressor lined up that should get the job done
 thanks!!

[HAULIN IT]

Ok, Here we go. The autobody industry is no different than anything else, you will get a wide variety of opinions on products & procedures. What one guy says works well, another has no use for.
 For starters, being your wanting to use a metallic/pearl color & the fact that the truck sits outside, you defiantly want to use a basecoat/clearcoat system. Do not buy the "best" products out there, to be real honest, a good man with a average product will end up with good results most of the time. An average man with the best products will still end up with an average job at best. With the BC/CC, you concentrate on putting the color on to achieve a uniform color & then put the clear on to get the shine, it really should be easier to achieve a first class job for a beginner. If you have some flaws (which you will) many can be sanded out of the clear, without effecting the flake lay-out, whereas with single stage, the color will be distorted. The clearcoat paint done properly holds up better in the weather than single stage. Also as Blazin mentioned, if you have to repaint an area, it's easier to make "look right".
 Being in the collision business over 20 years & doing hobby projects for longer than that...I've learned allot about bodywork & painting, however methods & products change nearly as I'm writing this. I will be glad to help in any way I can so you end up with a project your proud of. Please ask in the forum so all can discuss & learn. Lorne

[Jiggy]

Hey all.......I have a further paint question.

I am getting ready to buy a ton of paint and started calling around for prices.  Got a store that sells the PPG products and the guy was telling me about a less expensive line of paints (from PPG I believe).  The color is called Omni-base and the clear is called Shopline.  Anybody worked with these products before and what do you think?  The color is $110 a gallon and the clear is $91 a gallon.

[HAULIN IT]

Jiggy, I have used Shopline urethane primer with fairly good results, haven't done the clear. I have used Omni basecoat & the Omni clear with fair results also. One word of caution...the basecoat does not cover very well on allot of their colors. A color in DBU or DBC that covers in 3-4 coats takes 5-6 in Omni. Is it still cheaper, yeah, a little, but you need to be sure you have enough on it. My advice would be "When you think you have everything covered, put Two more coats on". I've seen several pretty good Omni jobs that in the sun you could see a primer spot or sand through area & the sprayers saying "I never saw that 'til we had all back together & took it outside. I guess we'll fix it later"  Lorne

[Blazin]

Agreed on the hiding of the Omni. I have used it several times and had problem with transparency. My 55 is done with Omni single stage. I am happy with the results but it too was transparent had to put a few extra coats on. As far as PPG itself I have never used much of it. I worked for a guy one time that used it, I sprayed it quite a few times that winter but I was never really impressed with it like Dupont. Especially the single stage acrylic enamels. Centari with 793 hardener had it way over the PPG.

[Jiggy]

Thanks for the responses.  I pretty much am talked out of it now cause if I'm going to have to buy extra gallons just to cover as well as the extra time involved, it just isn't worth it.

Where can I get the Transtar products that Blasin was talking about....any of the larger chains carry this that you know of before I start blind calling people?

[Blazin]

Also 5 star & Mar Hyde. I get 5 star from a local N.H. chain, Robbins auto parts. I get Trans Star from my local NAPA. They have just started doing full scale body, and paint sales about eight months ago. Not sure where they get there stuff from. The paint guy at my local NAPA was the paint guy at the Robbins chain for the last 12 years.

http://www.autobodybrands.com/

http://www.autobodytoolmart.com/c-1061-transtar-paint-products.aspx

http://www.smartshoppersinc.com/automotive-refinishes/mar-hyde.html