"was" looking at a 2005 crew cab 2500HD duramax

[Irish_Alley]

it was at a local dealer, Well the online price was 17,995, about 6k under book value. I get there the sales guy told me I’m in luck because its 1k off this week brings it to 18999. I didn’t tell him I knew about the 17995, kept that for my arsenal later. He then asked where I work (this is a tactic to make you feel more relaxed with them and see them as a friend) told him, and come to find out we had similar jobs we both where L.E.O.. Took it for a test drive, it pulled to the right and pulled really bad to the right when you got on the brakes. so I asked if they would fix this he said we would have to see after we deal(another tactic cause once you make a deal you’re  more likely to walk away happy you got the truck and not worry about the little things). Good news was I don’t need the truck I just wanted one. so he asked about trade in I have a 2004 impala SS 115000 kbb trade in is 4.2 I owe 6k.

We went inside he told me he could give me 2k (more profit for them for my car and put the rest on the truck so they would pay off the car. (I was thinking no I would be paying 4k on my car that they would have) so I told him that. He then said you’re not getting 6k for your car, I said yes I know but you’re not getting it for 2k. He then asked about a down payment, I told him 0 that got him upset(another tactic to hide fees is to use your down payment to lower the monthly payment so they can put fees in). He then went on about "how did you get your price" I told him kbb, he said "we don’t use them we use nada, kbb is west coast(they want you to feel like they are have controlled of everything). he then showed me 3 impala ss that went for auction (tactic again if they can give you 2k less for your trade in they will make 2k +interest) 1.7k 2k and 1.9k so he said you’re getting more than we would get at auction. I said that’s nice but I’m trading in my car not putting it at auction. One of the cars was in Michigan, I told him it’s salty there. and that car was probably ate out. Then another was in Arizona and another was in cal. I said they are west coast you don’t use west coast. but the bad thing is nada priced my car for about the same kbb did.

So he said we can get you in this truck for a payment of 478/month, cause of my credit score. They averaged the 3 and came up with 5 something. (Another tactic they lowered my score by averaging  the three to make me feel like it’s the best they could do) I just laughed at said what at 20%. I said don’t worry about the banks, my bank will approve me and the highest they go is 6.5%. he still wanted me to finance 26k (19k for the truck 4k for my car and 3k in taxes/tag) he did the whole 4 square deal just to confuse me with numbers but I may look stupid but I love math. And he finally lowered the truck cost to 17995. I told him that’s nice but that’s the internet price and you have to beat that. I then questioned the 3k for tags and title, I said in Md it only cost 1k for all that. He said well I just pulled those numbers off my head as a ball park figure(but it’s a tactic to make you think you’re paying for tags/title work when you’re just putting 2k into their pocket.)

He wouldn’t budge on the 2k for my car and asked what I would like to pay max/month. I said I would love to pay 200 laughing. He was starting to get a little agitated his tricks went working with me. He knew where I worked (doc) and people trying to push you around is something that you get used to and you learn not to back down. he then went back to his “manager” (he did this a couple time and it’s a tactic to make you feel like they are in control of you, you are waiting on them on their time) and came back minutes later with 17995 circled multiple times (another tactic to show they did the best they could and it’s your fault your monthly payment is so high) and 0 down circled multiple times and said we can’t budge on your monthly payment of 478 cause of the truck cost and your down payment. He then asked is 478 even feasible. I said even if it was I’m not paying that much a month for this truck. I then told him "you have to come down on the truck cost and up on the amount you wana give me for my car. Then I told him even 17500 would only be 350/month he didn’t even want to hear that he said how’s 470?(this is yet another tactic to make you get your mind off of a lower monthly this is why it’s important to talk about the final cost of the truck not your monthly payment and don’t stretch the payment out as far as it can go cause you will get a higher interest rate and pay more for the truck)

He then told me to go check out what my bank says and we will go from there. So knowing that he knew he lost this battle, I didn’t show any hesitation in walking away. Bank called me up and said we approved you for 6% I asked about my credit she said it was in the 600 (I forget the number but it was  in the middle of 600.) which is good since a couple years ago it was 400 due to gieco insurance and medical bills. ($10,000 medical deductible that I didn’t know I had)so knowing it would make life tighter with the truck (wife is a stay at home mom and money is tight) I would just have to work o.t. but this was for our company so it would be worth it.

I called the dealer about 1500 last night asked about the cost and availability of the truck. She said all the internet sales men where in a meeting and she could get one of them to call me back (this is a tactic they use to make you feel like they are in control of you) I said no I will call back. Hour later I called back, talked to her again she said she was just told an hour ago the truck is no longer for sale. I asked why, she said this is no joke it’ss leaking oil into the fuel” I was like ohhh ok and hung up. Didn’t know 05 had that problem about what I think she meant was the injectors leaking into the oil.

[Captkaos]

LOL,
I never mention a trade in UNTIL I have negotiated the out of door price.  Never mix buying vs selling.  Realistically you can walk to the use car section and ask them how much they will give you for it and get it in writing and the next day come back and ask about the one you are interested in.  I never negotiate the monthly payment either.  I decide how much I can afford per month and then multiply by 60, and then I don't move off of that amount, and when they ask I just say I am paying cash (via the check from the bank).

[Irish_Alley]

lol yeah i never had a trade worth trading before. i have been screwed the first time i got a car another 2004 impala ss. lessoned learned with that one, now lessoned learned with the trade deal. went back tonight after closing and the truck is sitting in thier "recent trade ins" section getting a co-worker to go in Monday and go undercover for me and see if they will offer him the truck

[Engineer]

I have never been able to trade in a vehicle.

When I bought my '02 Silverado I had ordered it. I had time to ponder the offers. Most dealerships figure your trade in off of MSRP so it looks like you are getting a wad of cash for it. After you deduct the difference on the new vehicle's MSRP vs cash price you notice they are not doing you the rich favors that they claim.

It is a bigger pain, but worth more in the long run, I just sell my trade in out right then buy the truck from the dealer without trades.

Another fat money gimmick they have is the extended warranty. They get a commission from the warranty brokers. I have had my 2002 Silverado 12 years. So far I have spent $0 for repairs, and warranty claims were less than $100.00 total before the factory warranty ran out.

I don't know who are society's bigger slime, car salesmen, or lawyers.

[Captkaos]

I treat the sell of my current vehicle in the same way as buying a new one.  Find the best deal and weigh the trouble of selling to getting cash.  I typically go to different used car places and dealer used lots to get pricing on a vehicles I was to get rid of.

I also got to several new lots find what I like at each, or find one I want if the same make and get them all to find and price.  Then I watch them and weekly make offers.  I drug this out on one vehicle for 6 months because it didnt sell and got it $6000 under invoice.

I also have an occasional bad habit of doing this for fun with no intention of buying.  I never purchase unless I am happy.  Just have to remind yourself that you already have a vehicle.

I wouldn't send someone else.  Just set the price at what you want in your mind and drive by and see if it is there and weekly make offers with the understanding you may or may not get it.

Chris Lucas
73-87chevytrucks.com
captkaoscustoms.com
squarebody.biz

[DnStClr]

I've been thinking about a new truck, but my 02 Duramax "only" has 125,000 miles and runs fine. I hate to put up with all the misleading that the stealers give, an it looks like Irish has run into it with the 05 he's lookin at.
The other day it was so cold here in Tn. that I saw a lawyer actually putting his hands in his own pockets...   

[Irish_Alley]

well from what i been reading the duramax can get 500k if maintained right. but then you still have the fuel pump and injector problems

[Stewart G Griffin]

i'm leaning toward buying a new/newer duramax truck vs. building a 6.2 truck.  Even though the 6.2 combo will much much cheaper numbers-wise, i'm looking at time vs. going to work and making money.

Can i ask what dealer it was?   We can do it through pm if you feel it's more appropriate.

[Irish_Alley]

i.g. burton in Delaware, I’m thinking of going up there tomorrow and talk to the gm about the truck. But curious how much do you think a truck whos value is $24k would go for at a dealers only auction?. the thing about the 6.6 duramax is it puts over 500 ft. lbs at 1500 rpms but I’m looking for a crew cab loaded 4x4 haven’t found a 4x2 duramax yet. And newer than 2004.5 that’s when gm changed the engine design to make injector changing much easier but still a pain. They ran the return lines under the valve covers and they are known to leak and then the diesel will replace the oil and then you have a crankcase full of diesel. The injectors are up there also seen them as cheap as I think $125/each so a v8 will be $1000 for the cheap injectors alone. I wana say a friend just had a shop change his 2002 cause I turned it down they charged him I wana say $4k? pre 2004.5 bosh changed the injectors design so they would fail as easy as before but its still not unheard of the "new" style to fail

[fitz]

How many miles are on this truck?
If the dealer is selling it for $17,995 they paid less than $14,000 for it.
Great trucks but they can cost some big $$ to keep running.
Your right about the injectors being a $4k job. Rebuilding an Allison auto trans runs about $5k.
I'm with Stewart, I'm a huge fan of the 6.2 detroit. Nowhere near the power of the duramax, but they sure are cheap to run.

[Irish_Alley]

108k, still havnt been by yet to see if they still have it. they still ist it online, but who knows. i could do the injector job myself but it would have to be worth it like at least 4-6k below what they want now and if they do the job it will bring the price way high.