Looking for recommendations for new exhaust

[Red87]

Hey everyone,

I've done some searching, but I'd still like to get some info from those of you who have changed out exhaust systems.  We own an 87 R10, and the original exhaust has rusted through in several spots, including the muffler.  So I'm now shopping for a new exhaust system, and I'd like to replace everything, including the headers.  The plan has always been to beef up the performance down the road, but we will be doing it in stages as money allows us to do so.  Here in Texas, we are exempt from emissions now, so I want to get the best bang for the buck.  Ultimately, I'd like to change the intake out and possible do some mild engine mods, but those will be later.

So what do you all recommend for an exhaust system, given my situation?  I'd like a dual setup with exits right behind the rear wheels.  Other than that, I'm open to suggestions.

TIA.

[Captkaos]

I sell this X pype kit.
http://store.73-87chevytrucks.com/merchant2/merchant.mvc?Screen=PROD&Store_Code=7&Product_Code=SGT80&Category_Code=73-87UHood

A reconfigured version of it is on my Twin Turbo R10..

[rich weyand]

You don't say small-block or big-block.  I have a small block, so this advice only applies to SBC.

I did Hooker long-tube headers #2453 and Flowmaster 40s.  A local shop mandrel-bent all the pipes out of 2-1/4", and fabbed in a 2" H-pipe.  Mine go straight out the back.

Use Flowmaster 50s if you don't want to make a lot of noise.  They are quieter than the 40s.  Then again, I like the 40's.  Nice rap when the engine gets breathing good.

[Red87]

You don't say small-block or big-block.  I have a small block, so this advice only applies to SBC.

I did Hooker long-tube headers #2453 and Flowmaster 40s.  A local shop mandrel-bent all the pipes out of 2-1/4", and fabbed in a 2" H-pipe.  Mine go straight out the back.

Use Flowmaster 50s if you don't want to make a lot of noise.  They are quieter than the 40s.  Then again, I like the 40's.  Nice rap when the engine gets breathing good.

Sorry, it's a small block.  Thanks for the info.  So should I be looking for a muffler shop to do the custom bending/fitting?  Did you supply the pipe or let the shop supply it?  What was your cost for the shop to do their work?

[bake74]

    One thing to consider also.  Long tube headers are great for low end torque and HP, while short tube headers are better at high end torque and HP.  Just saying so you can decide what you want out of your truck.

[Mario]

Consider headers with thicker wall tubing.  I used a cheaper Hedman header twice, and blew holes in the bends closest to the head.  Currently, I use a racing Hedman header, and haven't had any issues in a few years.  Honestly, I don't like the clearances at the collectors.  Also, I live in an area where exhaust shops haven't spent money on mandrel bending machines, so I custom fabricated a system with 2-1/2" stainless steel pieces.  That was over 13 years ago.  They still look the same as ever.  I've changed mufflers once, and recently upgraded to Magnaflow stainless steel mufflers.  There are companies across the country that have pre-bent kits available for our trucks.  You may spend twice as much as mild steel, but a stainless steel system will outlast at least two mild steel systems.

[rich weyand]

The headers were already on the truck.  The muffler shop mandrel bent all the pipes, and supplied the hangers and the Flowmaster 40s, and fabbed in the H-pipe, tucking everything up tight to the underside, for about $500 out the door.

[LeftysRodandCustom]

I like the flowmasters also, and a buddy of mine bought a set of summits copy cat of a flowmaster 40. Sounds really good at half the price. And the only place a long tube header is ever beaten by a short one is clearance. Stainless as was mentioned will literally outlast two sets of steel, but its tougher to make them fit the budget sometimes. If you dont want the small block cackle consider and H or X pipe also.

[Red87]

Thanks for all the added info.  So here's where I'm at with this project.  I stopped by a local, reputable muffler shop in the area and spoke with the owner.  I told him that I would supply the headers & a better fastener kit for it, and he quoted me $550 to do the rest, including Flowmaster 40s, and have the duals exit out the back behind each wheel.  I left to think it over, but then remembered I forgot to ask him if he mandrel bent the pipes.  So I called him back, and he said they do not have a mandrel bender...too much money for one.  Everything I've read on the subject has pointed toward mandrel bent tubing being better for flow.

So I have more questions for you guys:

1.  Given the fact that I'm not doing any motor/intake work yet, would I really feel the difference between mandrel bent vs. traditionally bent tubing?
2.  I definitely want quality long tube headers, so what have you guys specifically used or which ones should I stay away from?
3.  Will I be affecting the driveability of this truck by just changing the exhaust out to a better flowing one without touching the intake?  I'm sure the electronic TBI will adjust to the change, but I'm not 100% sure on that.  I definitely don't want to go through this expense, only to find that the truck drives like a pig afterward.
4.  I'm not entirely set on the FM 40s, so if there is a better option for mufflers, let me know your thoughts and what has/hasn't worked for you
5.  H-pipe vs X-pipe.  I've read that I need one, but I'm not sure which would be better in my application

Down the road, I'll do some intake and motor work, but for right now, I just want a good, quality exhaust system that won't break the bank, will sound good and won't give me any problems for the next few years.  Icing on the cake would be an exhaust system that would work when I do decide to break into the motor/intake.

TIA

[bake74]

1.  Given the fact that I'm not doing any motor/intake work yet, would I really feel the difference between mandrel bent vs. traditionally bent tubing?

     Mandrel bent pipe is better because it has no restrictions in the bends.  It is stretched in the corners making them smoother, so to get the best free flowing exhaust that will have the least restrictive flow, mandrel is the way to go.
     With that being said, unless you plan on pumping out a lot of HP out of your SBC, I don't think you personally will be able to tell the difference.  It also depends a lot of the rest of the exhaust and what kind of muffler you buy.  Traditionally racing style mufflers has a free flowing chamber that does not restrict the flow through the muffler, but they are loud.  You just need to do your homework on which muffler is best for you.

2.  I definitely want quality long tube headers, so what have you guys specifically used or which ones should I stay away from

     Again, stay away from the cheaply made, thin walled headers, they won't last and you will be replacing them.

3.  Will I be affecting the driveability of this truck by just changing the exhaust out to a better flowing one without touching the intake?  I'm sure the electronic TBI will adjust to the change, but I'm not 100% sure on that.  I definitely don't want to go through this expense, only to find that the truck drives like a pig afterward.

     Yes, but not in the way you think.  A better flowing exhaust will only allow the engine to perform better, even it you do nothing to the intake (more air into engine), or internals in the engine (internal/bolt on power upgrades for the engine).
     Think of it this way.  The engine produces power through chemical reaction and converts it to mechanical power to power your truck.  The chemical process produces gases which need to be dealt with.
     Your exhaust valves are in charge of exiting these gases.  So if you have the best free flowing exhaust, with the correct muffler and size of pipes, you can actually create somewhat of a vacuum effect with your exhaust which in turn will pull more of the gases out of the combustion chamber which in turn will allow the new mixture coming in to be pure and diluted with old gas, which in turn will allow more HP out of every cycle.  So the opposite to this is not all the old gases leave the combustion chamber and when the new cycle begins and the new mix comes into the combustion chamber, it is diluted right off the bat which in turn reduces the amount of HP it can generate from the chemical process.

4.  I'm not entirely set on the FM 40s, so if there is a better option for mufflers, let me know your thoughts and what has/hasn't worked for you

      This I always like to tell people to do there own homework.  We all have different taste when it comes to sound and noise levels.  There are thousands of sound video's on the web to listen to and compare, just make sure you are comparing apples to apples, not apples to oranges.   

5.  H-pipe vs X-pipe.  I've read that I need one, but I'm not sure which would be better in my application

      They both have there advantages, but are necessary to equal out a dual exhaust, so you get even sound coming out the back, and not one side louder than the other.  Again, this is a circumstance that requires you to choose for yourself and see what one you like the best.
      A lot depends on room, not everyone has the room under there truck to run a H pipe.  Some don't have the room to run a X pipe, depends on if you can find a place to install them and which fits the best.  I don't know if you will ever be able to tell the difference in how the engine runs, maybe a dyno might be able to tell the difference.
     Hope this helps and sorry it got a little winded.


 

[Red87]

Thanks for the info...definitely not long-winded for me.  I know sound is subjective, and it comes down to personal taste.  I'm not overly concerned with how loud it is, because it is not our DD anymore.  We so have three young children under 3, so I don't want it ear-splitting either.

Appreciate your input again.

[Rich84]

If you plan on communicating with your children don't get the 40's..Also, I found them to drone horribly on the highway.
For me they were way to loud for the amount of power that my engine produces. I added resonators to tone them down a bit.

[Red87]

If you plan on communicating with your children don't get the 40's..Also, I found them to drone horribly on the highway.
For me they were way to loud for the amount of power that my engine produces. I added resonators to tone them down a bit.

That is good to know.  Maybe the 50s are the way to go.  I'll have to start listening to some clips online and read more on them before I make up my mind.

[KWKENUF]

5.  H-pipe vs X-pipe.  I've read that I need one, but I'm not sure which would be better in my application

I have been told by several well respected sources that an h-pipe installed as far up stream as possible is going to give you the best performance advantage.  The purpose of the h-pipe is to balance the exhaust pressure side to side.  The sooner you can do that the better,  hence why you install it as far forward as possible.  I saw a dyno sheet on a 500hp big block that gained a solid 30hp by only installing an h-pipe.

[Red87]

5.  H-pipe vs X-pipe.  I've read that I need one, but I'm not sure which would be better in my application

I have been told by several well respected sources that an h-pipe installed as far up stream as possible is going to give you the best performance advantage.  The purpose of the h-pipe is to balance the exhaust pressure side to side.  The sooner you can do that the better,  hence why you install it as far forward as possible.  I saw a dyno sheet on a 500hp big block that gained a solid 30hp by only installing an h-pipe.

I've read that, too.  As long as I have room underneath, that's the plan.  Thanks!