I failed emissions and told I have an ILLEGAL engine

[Irish_Alley]

stew maybe the gvwr. dont think it ever went to 1 ton but know they made a ¾ ton it was around 8000 gvwr

[plik]

stew maybe the gvwr. dont think it ever went to 1 ton but know they made a ¾ ton it was around 8000 gvwr

Yes, I think it's the difference between the 3/4 ton and 1/2 ton, and 1500 and 2500 models (I think, I'm still not sure).

[plik]

Yeah but is the database the issue or is it the goofball you dealt with?

I meant I can't go to another location because the top guy already put his notes into the database. So, if I roll into any location, they'll see that I've already been to the main office and the top guy gave it a failure.

So, I either have to modify my vehicle to his satisfaction, or another option is to get a class 3 inspection and have the vehicle re-titled as a modified car (like you would with a hot rod). This I just found out about earlier today.

[Stewart G Griffin]

stew maybe the gvwr. dont think it ever went to 1 ton but know they made a ¾ ton it was around 8000 gvwr

Right, but i mean how is AZ defining heavy duty?    i thought like tractor-trailer = heavy duty,  box trucks = medium duty,  pickups, vans= light duty etc.

Now, if they mean 8600lbs. gvwr and above is "heavy duty,"  then it maybe easiest to just remove the O2 sensor---it's not that difficult.

If they're defining "light duty engine" as having an O2 sensor (as if this guy is an expert on SBC's and really is there such thing as a "heavy duty" sbc?   4 bolt mains don't count), then i guess just go along with the game and remove it.

[Joec123able]

The only thing I love about iowa, no inspections.

[Irish_Alley]

the only weight im seeing in AZ is 8500. and it doesnt make a difference if its over or under it still has emissions. if its over its every year and under its every other year.
OP take a read back in 2010 someone had the same issue as you. could only swap with the same year or you "violated" laws and no tag for them
https://forum.ih8mud.com/threads/update-az-engine-swaps-ouch.387955/
the big boss had no idea what his indians were doing


also talk to this company
http://www.phoenixengine.com/Chevy-16.html
they build motors and are out of AZ they should know about any issues you may run into or loopholes


and a quote from here

You can have no emissions equipment on your car in Phoenix and still get registration. Get collector car insurance (very cheap ~$350/yr) on your car and you no longer need emissions and can get 5 year tags (~$80). My car has no charcoal canister, no smog pump, no EGR, long tubes, no cats, and its no problem.

[AZ4X4SQBDY]

I found this out there

http://www.73-87.com/7387info/7387emislevel.htm

it's saying the truck should not have cats if it's over 8600 GVW and this is what defines "heavy duty".



Is your truck 8600 GVW or more?

I don't think the guy is trying to be difficult, just put yourself in his shoes and think about how many cobbled together vehicles come through his place everyday. He is just doing it by the book.  The one thing I noticed about the company that is running the program here in Phoenix is they will not tell you how to correct the issue, they will only provide a list of garages that will perform the repairs. They are just covering their rears.

I recently sold a '87 Chevy truck that required a emissions test before I could sell it. The truck failed the evaporative portion of the test so I ran it home, dropped the tank and changed out all the rubber fuel lines and took it back there 5 hours later. They asked what I did to correct it, I explained and for some reason he seemed amazed. They re ran the test, it passed, met the buyer at the title place and down the road it went.

[Irish_Alley]

turck should have cats if it was a diesel. but with the motor swap i think you have to pass for that motor (hence failing for no air pump). or people who swap diesels for gas motors would never pass

[plik]

Would a heavy duty truck in 1987 have an air pump?

And if so, how can I prove it?

[AZ4X4SQBDY]

Would a heavy duty truck in 1987 have an air pump?

And if so, how can I prove it?

I would believe so.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Secondary_air_injection

To prove it, I guess you could show him the vin on the block with the original vehicles vin number and then break it down for him show when it was built.

To get this guy off your back and your truck legal, it needs an air pump with exhaust manifolds and no catalytic converters. If it had the air pump, you could argue that you went the extra effort and installed new catalytic converters but with out the air pump they will not work efficiently. The converters do not take the place of an air pump and do not do the same job.

I have a 1985 Chevy K10 in my signature that I'm building. It came out of Colorado and was not emission compliant there because they put a cam, headers, wrong intake and carb, no EGR, etc. I bought a complete 1987 C10 with a factory 5.7 TBI, dual tanks and factory exhaust system with a cat to swap into the truck to get it though the emissions. I feel I will not have an issue but in reading this thread I have my doubts.  When I first bought it and learned all about the local Phoenix emissions program it ended up with historic plates and classic insurance. I figured it should have been exempted because of age but apparently not. They are tough around here.

[csdineley]

Would a heavy duty truck in 1987 have an air pump?

And if so, how can I prove it?

Here's the emission sticker from my 87 R20 c6p 350 tbi 8600 GVW

[plik]

Would a heavy duty truck in 1987 have an air pump?

And if so, how can I prove it?

Here's the emission sticker from my 87 R20 c6p 350 tbi 8600 GVW

Thank you so much. This is tremendously helpful. 

[ehjorten]

Here is a breakdown:
http://www.afdc.energy.gov/data/10380

And did I miss what version of Suburban you have?  Is it a C10, K10, C20 or K20?  If the GVWR is 8,501 to 10,000 it is considered to be a class 2b heavy duty vehicle.

I feel reasonably certain that a C20 or K20 was offered in 1984 with a 350, 454 or the 6.2L Diesel!

The 305 was the one that wasn't offered with the 3/4 ton, so their contention that the 350 is a light-duty engine is false!

[Irish_Alley]

His gvwr is 8600. I have a 350 in my 9600. I just don't know and I think the question is did the "HD" motor have emissions and if they didn't like the station is saying then why does he have an o2 sensor

[plik]

UPDATE:

I found out that my engine is a "heavy duty" engine. :-) The small, petty man at the emissions testing facility was wrong after all. He said it was light duty because of the O2 sensor, etc. -- wrong; heavy duty engines can be configured with an O2 sensor, etc.

The only differences are compression ratios and bolts on main.

LD: 2-bolt main, 9.25:1 Compression ratio
HD: 4-bolt main, 8.75:1 Compression ratio

http://paceperformance.com/i-6485019-12568758-5-7l-350cid-lo5-k-1987-1995-chevy-gmc-full-size-trucks-g-van-up-to-7200-gvw.html
http://paceperformance.com/i-6484911-12520270-5-7l-350cid-lo5-k-1987-1995-chevy-gmc-full-size-trucks-g-van-1996-2002-p-van-over-8600-gvw.html

Thanks to everyone for all your help. It is much appreciated. :-)