Author Topic: 8.1 liter problems  (Read 7711 times)

Offline choptop

  • Senior Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 2476
  • Extended cab fanatic
    • conversiontrucks
8.1 liter problems
« on: March 25, 2008, 10:54:04 pm »
I hate to bother you guys with this, but this is the most knowlegdable group I know. I just bought an 01 3500 crewcab dually with the 8.1 in it. Good price, low miles, only problem is cam position sensor (p0343 code) Where is this sensor located and how much of a pain is it to change?? I appreciate your time on a not so cool truck.
76 C10 Choptop,76 C10 Swb
85 C10, 85 K10, 85 K20,86 C10,86 K10 (all extended cabs)
86 C30 extended crewcab

Offline VileZambonie

  • Global Moderator
  • Senior Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 19170
Re: 8.1 liter problems
« Reply #1 on: March 26, 2008, 04:57:56 am »
CIRCUIT DESCRIPTION
The Camshaft Position (CMP) sensor works in conjunction with a 1X reluctor wheel on the camshaft. The Powertrain Control Module (PCM) provides a 12-volt reference circuit to the CMP sensor as well as a low reference and a signal circuit.

The CMP sensor determines whether a cylinder is on a firing stroke or on an exhaust stroke. As the camshaft rotates, the reluctor wheel interrupts a magnetic field produced by a magnet within the sensor. The sensors internal circuitry detects this and produces a signal which the PCM reads. The PCM uses this lx signal in combination with the Crankshaft Position (CKP) sensor 24X signal in order to determine crankshaft position and stroke. This diagnostic for the CMP sensor checks for a loss of CMP sensor signal.

Observe that as long as the PCM receives the CKP sensor 24X signal, the engine will start. The PCM can determine top dead center for all cylinders by using the CKP sensor 24X signal alone. The CMP sensor lx signal is used by the PCM to determine if the cylinder at top dead center is on the firing stroke, or the exhaust stroke. The system attempts synchronization and looks for an increase in engine speed indicating the engine started. If the PCM does not detect an increase in engine speed, the PCM assumes that the PCM incorrectly synchronized to the exhaust stroke and re-syncs to the opposite cam position. A slightly longer cranking time may be a symptom of this condition.

CONDITIONS FOR RUNNING THE DTC
The engine speed is less than 4,000 RPM.

CONDITIONS FOR SETTING THE DTC
The PCM detects the cam signal is stuck high when the signal should be low for 1.5 seconds .

ACTION TAKEN WHEN THE DTC SETS


The control module illuminates the Malfunction Indicator Lamp (MIL) on the second consecutive ignition cycle that the diagnostic runs and fails.
The control module records the operating conditions at the time the diagnostic fails. The first time the diagnostic fails, the control module stores this information in the Failure Records. If the diagnostic reports a failure on the second consecutive ignition cycle, the control module records the operating conditions at the time of the failure. The control module writes the operating conditions to the Freeze Frame and updates the Failure Records.
CONDITIONS FOR CLEARING THE MIL/DTC


The control module turns OFF the Malfunction Indicator Lamp (MIL) after 3 consecutive ignition cycles that the diagnostic runs and does not fail.
A current DTC, Last Test Failed, clears when the diagnostic runs and passes.
A history DTC clears after 40 consecutive warm-up cycles, if no failures are reported by this or any other emission related diagnostic.
Use a scan tool in order to clear the MIL and the DTC.
DIAGNOSTIC AIDS
The following conditions may cause this DTC to set:


Camshaft reluctor wheel damage
The sensor coming in contact with the reluctor wheel
Foreign material passing between the sensor and the reluctor wheel
Using Freeze Frame/Failure Records data may aid in locating an intermittent condition. If you cannot duplicate the DTC, the information included in the Freeze Frame/Failure Records data can aid in determining how many miles since the DTC set. The Fail Counter and Pass Counter can also aid determining how many ignition cycles the diagnostic reported a pass or a fail. Operate the vehicle within the same Freeze Frame conditions such as RPM, load, vehicle speed, temperature, etc. that you observed. This will isolate when the DTC failed.

The CMP sensor output can be tested. The sensor must be supplied with a power and a ground. The engine must be cranking to perform this test. You can measure the duty cycle at the signal circuit of the sensor. The duty cycle should be between 45-55 percent for a good sensor.

If the problem is intermittent, refer to Intermittent Conditions. See: Initial Inspection and Diagnostic Overview\Diagnostic Strategies\Intermittent Conditions

TEST DESCRIPTION






The numbers below refer to the step numbers on the diagnostic table.


This step verifies that the fault is present. A hard start is observed when a malfunction is present.
This step tests the CMP sensor 12-volt reference circuit from the PCM to the CMP.
This step tests the CMP sensor low reference circuit from the PCM to the CMP.
This step tests the CMP sensor signal circuit. Applying a voltage causes the CAM signal input high to low and low to high parameter to increase if the circuit and the PCM are operating properly.
This step tests the resistance of the CMP sensor 12-volt reference circuit from the PCM to the CMP sensor.
This step tests the resistance of the CMP sensor low reference circuit from the PCM to the CMP sensor


It's #1 in this picture and here's the procedure to replace if necessary
Raise the vehicle. Refer to Lifting and Jacking the Vehicle.
If the vehicle is equipped with the underbody shield package, remove the steering linkage shield.
Disconnect the Camshaft Position (CMP) sensor harness connector (3) at the CMP sensor (1).
Remove the CMP sensor retaining bolt (2).
Remove the CMP sensor (1).
Inspect the CMP sensor for wear, cracks, or leakage if the sensor is not being replaced.
INSTALLATION PROCEDURE

IMPORTANT: Inspect the CMP sensor O-ring for wear or damage. If a problem is found, replace the O-ring. Lubricate the new O-ring with engine oil before installing.

 
 
 
 



Install the CMP sensor (1). NOTE: Refer to Fastener Notice in Service Precautions.
Install the CMP sensor retaining bolt (2). Tighten Tighten the bolt to 12 N.m (106 lb in) .
Connect the CMP sensor harness connector (3)
Install the steering linkage shield, if equipped.
Lower the vehicle.
,                           ___ 
                         /  _ _ _\_
              ⌠ŻŻŻŻŻ'   [☼===☼]
              `()_);-;()_)--o--)_)

74 GMC, 75 K5, 84 GMC, 85 K20, 86 k20, 79 K10

Offline VileZambonie

  • Global Moderator
  • Senior Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 19170
Re: 8.1 liter problems
« Reply #2 on: March 26, 2008, 04:59:09 am »
the image restriction makes them illegible. Click on these links to be able to read the tables

http://i6.photobucket.com/albums/y228/Sabaka454/p0343.gif

http://i6.photobucket.com/albums/y228/Sabaka454/p0343a.gif
,                           ___ 
                         /  _ _ _\_
              ⌠ŻŻŻŻŻ'   [☼===☼]
              `()_);-;()_)--o--)_)

74 GMC, 75 K5, 84 GMC, 85 K20, 86 k20, 79 K10

Offline choptop

  • Senior Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 2476
  • Extended cab fanatic
    • conversiontrucks
Re: 8.1 liter problems
« Reply #3 on: March 26, 2008, 07:06:51 am »
Thanks Vile, I appreciate it. I am gonna see if I can get it fixed today. I hadn't looked for it because it was dark when I got in, but I am glad it isn't the crank pos sensor. I know it is more of a pain to replace.Thanks again.
76 C10 Choptop,76 C10 Swb
85 C10, 85 K10, 85 K20,86 C10,86 K10 (all extended cabs)
86 C30 extended crewcab

Offline Bitzer!

  • Junior Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 906
  • Smiles per gallon
Re: 8.1 liter problems
« Reply #4 on: March 26, 2008, 09:13:31 am »
I'm surprised you have time to teach Vile ;D What a superb answer - as always well written and understandable!!.  I hope you realise how much us less edjucated guys appreciate your time. Top Dawg  :)
1979 GMC CrewCab  C20 1t
454 750 Holley,TH350, 14bolt diff fully floating
Why aren't there 8 days in a week!
A K5 rolling shell *new addition*

Offline Redneckchevy

  • Junior Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 697
    • Photo Bucket
Re: 8.1 liter problems
« Reply #5 on: March 26, 2008, 09:17:08 am »
Its the truth....I dont no ware i would be if vile wasnt a member! Might be driving a Ford pinto lol
1986 Chevrolet K10 Swb "Women love the hood scoop"
1997 Chevrolet K10 Lwb "Dunno what women love"

Offline choptop

  • Senior Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 2476
  • Extended cab fanatic
    • conversiontrucks
Re: 8.1 liter problems
« Reply #6 on: March 26, 2008, 09:19:20 pm »
Got it replaced, no other problems. I really do appreciate it. You are awesome. ;D
76 C10 Choptop,76 C10 Swb
85 C10, 85 K10, 85 K20,86 C10,86 K10 (all extended cabs)
86 C30 extended crewcab